On Tuesday, October 5, 2021 at 9:52:42 AM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:> On 10/5/2021 6:32 AM, Fred Bloggs wrote: > > On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 9:25:30 PM UTC-4, DJ Delorie wrote: > >> Fred Bloggs <bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> writes: > >>> Of course it is. If your basement is getting warm, you don't have enough > >>> ventilation. I assume you're talking about cooling season, so you might > >>> consider running an A/C instead of dehumidifier. > >> We're between seasons; the dehumidifyer is a 24/7 version that runs all > >> year long (although it cycles less often in the winter, of course) to > >> protect my shop tools from rust and keep the wood humidity more constant. > >> The geothermal system has a few vents in the basement to help with > >> temperature. > > > > So there's a minor detail of this place being a "shop" and not a climate > > controlled finished space. > That doesn't necessarily follow. Many folks here set up (wood) shops > in their extra garage bays (because we don't have basements and the > womenfolk tend to get annoyed at having lathes set up in spare bedrooms!) > which are "climate controlled". In fact, it is almost essential if you > want to store any lumber, steel, etc. around (the alternative being > outdoors -- or, in the forbidden bedrooms!).https://www.waterproofmag.com/2011/01/drainage-dos-and-donts/> > Was going to say if you have to run the > > dehumidifier 24/7, the construction is cheap with major air leaks and other > > means of moisture infiltration. It would be simpler to rehabilitate the > > construction by sealing the air and water leaks. > Likewise, without knowing WHERE he is located, it isn't possible to > imagine the reason for the "problems". Living in New England, basements > were often "high humidity" just as a consequence of the wetter environment > and the lack of below-grade air circulation. We ran a dehumidifier > in our "laundry room" to help keep the air, there, less humid > (the extra heat thrown off in the "furnace room" eliminated the need > for it, there. and, the workshop was too busy with tools to bother > with such "obstructions") > > Here, we'd consider adding humidification to help improve comfort > levels. I'm fond of running the swamp cooler in the Summer (before > Monsoon) as the cool, moist air feels delightful on my skin. But, > SWMBO dislikes it. And, given the nature of a democracy, her vote > counts more than mine (so I have to tolerate year round refrigeration)
Anyone hear of a 120V clothes dryer?
Started by ●October 4, 2021
Reply by ●October 5, 20212021-10-05
Reply by ●October 5, 20212021-10-05
On Mon, 4 Oct 2021 11:42:30 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs <bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com> wrote:>On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 1:02:09 PM UTC-4, Ralph Mowery wrote: >> In article <ao4mlgdriq8jv5q01...@4ax.com>, >> jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com says... >> > >> > A heat pump clothes dryer sounds over-the-top to me. One of those >> > won't reduce global temperature by a picokelvin. And has refrigerent >> > inside. >> > >> > >> I always though the heat pump for small things was way over kill and >> something else to go wrong. I have a heat pump for the house and it >> works very well and inexpensive to operate. In the climite I live in the >> HP is the way to go for most as the temperture is seldom over 100 deg F >> and seldom below 20 deg F most of the time. Mostly in the 90 to 30 deg >> range. I would not want one for the water heater or clothes dryer or >> anything else that I can think of to produce heat. > >Heat pump water heaters actually save a bundle.Given the (insane) idea of heating water with electricity, probably so. Solar pre-heating can make sense in some places, but is barely worth the hassle. Wastewater heat exchangers ditto. -- Father Brown's figure remained quite dark and still; but in that instant he had lost his head. His head was always most valuable when he had lost it.
Reply by ●October 5, 20212021-10-05
On 10/4/2021 5:22 PM, Rick C wrote:> On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 1:33:34 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: >> mandag den 4. oktober 2021 kl. 19.27.55 UTC+2 skrev bitrex: >>> On 10/4/2021 4:55 AM, Sylvia Else wrote: >>>> On 04-Oct-21 7:27 pm, Rob wrote: >>>>> Rick C <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>> The dryer here seems to be plugged into a 120V outlet. It's also on >>>>>> an extension cord. Anyone see anything like that before? >>>>>> >>>>>> I suppose it's actually a 240V connector which is the same size as a >>>>>> standard 120V connector but having one or more pins turned 90 >>>>>> degrees. Still, those aren't very high current. >>>>> >>>>> Over here in Europe we have clothes dryers that use heat pumping >>>>> instead of electric heating. They use like 700-1000W of power so >>>>> they could easily work from a standard 120V socket. >>>> >>>> They no doubt save energy, but at what cost? They don't sound economic. >>>> >>>> Sylvia. >>> They make these portable dishwashers also, you can wash literally about >>> 5 dishes in them: >>> >>> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttYboBVP0EE> >>> >>> I'm not so un-ameniable to "women's work" that I can't hand-wash 5 >>> dishes and some knives and forks. Loading and programming the machine >>> probably takes longer, anyway. >> but it saves water and things get cleaner .. > > It saves how much water...? You can only save what is being used by hand washing which isn't much for five plates and some silver. If hand washing gets them clean, how can the washer get them "cleaner"? Is this like a volume control that goes to 11? >I worked as a dish-washer in college; the plates and flatware were put through an industrial-sized conveyor-belt dishwasher but the cookware was scrubbed by hand by a small crew and then soaked in a tub of some rather foul-smelling disinfectant (Iodophor) before a rinse and set out to air-dry. The best way to get stuff clean with a minimum of water is scrub them! No automatic dishwashers physically scrub the stuff you put in them AFAIK. Those touchless "laser car washes" do okay but they use a huge lot of water to do what you can do better with a car mop and a few buckets of soapy water. Those old-style "flapper" ones tend to be the worst, the newer designs I think can do better in theory but in my experience they tend to run the conveyor belt too fast to increase throughput and the car never gets as clean as the water jets from the touchless place can do, particularly the roof. Never been to an automatic car wash that was worth a shit with respect to getting the roof very clean.
Reply by ●October 5, 20212021-10-05
On Tuesday, October 5, 2021 at 10:05:42 AM UTC-4, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:> On Mon, 4 Oct 2021 11:42:30 -0700 (PDT), Fred Bloggs > <bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote: > > >On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 1:02:09 PM UTC-4, Ralph Mowery wrote: > >> In article <ao4mlgdriq8jv5q01...@4ax.com>, > >> jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com says... > >> > > >> > A heat pump clothes dryer sounds over-the-top to me. One of those > >> > won't reduce global temperature by a picokelvin. And has refrigerent > >> > inside. > >> > > >> > > >> I always though the heat pump for small things was way over kill and > >> something else to go wrong. I have a heat pump for the house and it > >> works very well and inexpensive to operate. In the climite I live in the > >> HP is the way to go for most as the temperture is seldom over 100 deg F > >> and seldom below 20 deg F most of the time. Mostly in the 90 to 30 deg > >> range. I would not want one for the water heater or clothes dryer or > >> anything else that I can think of to produce heat. > > > >Heat pump water heaters actually save a bundle. > > Given the (insane) idea of heating water with electricity, probably > so. > > Solar pre-heating can make sense in some places, but is barely worth > the hassle. Wastewater heat exchangers ditto.Solar works in New England, meaning it will work anywhere. They always require additional waters storage tanks and significant interior construction to make room for everything, making it a real hassle for backfitting into an existing structure.. https://www.energy.gov/energysaver/solar-water-heaters> > > > > > -- > > Father Brown's figure remained quite dark and still; > but in that instant he had lost his head. His head was > always most valuable when he had lost it.
Reply by ●October 5, 20212021-10-05
On Mon, 4 Oct 2021 13:23:55 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:>On 10/4/2021 10:59 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote: >> On Mon, 4 Oct 2021 11:17:16 -0000 (UTC), >> DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org wrote: >> >>> Rob <nomail@example.com> wrote in >>> news:slrnsllio0.57u.nomail@xs9.xs4all.nl: >>> >>>> Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> wrote: >>>>> On 04-Oct-21 7:27 pm, Rob wrote: >>>>>> Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>> The dryer here seems to be plugged into a 120V outlet. It's >>>>>>> also on an extension cord. Anyone see anything like that >>>>>>> before? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I suppose it's actually a 240V connector which is the same size >>>>>>> as a standard 120V connector but having one or more pins turned >>>>>>> 90 degrees. Still, those aren't very high current. >>>>>> >>>>>> Over here in Europe we have clothes dryers that use heat pumping >>>>>> instead of electric heating. They use like 700-1000W of power >>>>>> so they could easily work from a standard 120V socket. >>>>> >>>>> They no doubt save energy, but at what cost? They don't sound >>>>> economic. >>>>> >>>>> Sylvia. >>>> >>>> They cost like 300 euro more, which we save on electricity costs >>>> in about 4 years. >>>> >>>> Not a stunning economic difference, but you know what? In Europe >>>> we do consider the environment, and are not only watching pennies >>>> as a decisiion criterium when buying energy wasting equipment. >>>> >>>> Maybe in the US you should start doing that too! >>>> >>> >>> We do and have for decades. We call them Clothes lines. >> >> Some places have sudden rain showers, which can be a nuisance. >> >> Women used to be always-available housewives and could watch out for >> the clothes on the line. Not so much today. My gram in New Orleans >> would shriek and run out to collect the wash at the first drops. They >> would take essentially forever to dry in the winter, at 90% humidity, >> and would often come off the line smelling sour and musty. >> >> She had 8 kids and cooked over a wood stove. No time for college or a >> career. > > >This is how many of the "great men of history" had the free time to >accomplish what they did, there was always a woman or two around fixing >their meals and picking up their poopy drawers off the floor.Or had servants in general. Servants used to be cheap. I hope you aren't developing a poop fetish like some other people here.> >Not big surprise women eventually got tired of it...The big liberating factor, for men and for women, was technology, specifically electric power. While the women were doing housework and minding kids (with no public schools to help) the men were plowing and digging and hauling, with maybe an animal to help if they could afford one. It took hundreds of men to run a sailing ship. The new concept is none. -- Father Brown's figure remained quite dark and still; but in that instant he had lost his head. His head was always most valuable when he had lost it.
Reply by ●October 5, 20212021-10-05
On Mon, 4 Oct 2021 20:00:43 -0700, John Robertson <spam@flippers.com> wrote:> >On 2021/10/04 2:55 p.m., Rick C wrote: >> On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 2:57:25 PM UTC-4, John Robertson wrote: >>> On 2021/10/04 12:30 a.m., Rick C wrote: >>>> The dryer here seems to be plugged into a 120V outlet. It's also on an extension cord. Anyone see anything like that before? >>>> >>>> I suppose it's actually a 240V connector which is the same size as a standard 120V connector but having one or more pins turned 90 degrees. Still, those aren't very high current. >>>> >>> 26 of them at Home Depot: >>> >>> https://www.homedepot.com/b/Appliances-Washers-Dryers-Dryers-Electric-Dryers/120-volt/N-5yc1vZc3q1Z1z17ja4 >> >> This one says 15 amps, so it requires a 20 amp circuit? Or are they specifying the circuit capacity? They are not at all clear on the electrical requirement, but they give tons of info on running the duct! Nothing about the connector. But they do say the power cord is included! Just no details on what to plug it into. >> > >20Amps would be fine, however if the machine is rated at 15A and the >outlet is the only connection to the breaker then a 15A breaker should >work. > >Treat it like a refrigerator, only a single (not duplex) outlet that >only goes to a single breaker - either 15A or 20A. > >If unsure check with your local electrical codes, my advice is not as a >certified Electrician, merely a home electrician who always reads the >electrical code books for my province (or state in the USA) when doing >work in my home. > >John :-#)#I've read the San Francisco electrical code. I've never met a licensed electrician who has. -- Father Brown's figure remained quite dark and still; but in that instant he had lost his head. His head was always most valuable when he had lost it.
Reply by ●October 5, 20212021-10-05
On 10/5/2021 10:08 AM, bitrex wrote:> On 10/4/2021 5:22 PM, Rick C wrote: >> On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 1:33:34 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: >>> mandag den 4. oktober 2021 kl. 19.27.55 UTC+2 skrev bitrex: >>>> On 10/4/2021 4:55 AM, Sylvia Else wrote: >>>>> On 04-Oct-21 7:27 pm, Rob wrote: >>>>>> Rick C <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>> The dryer here seems to be plugged into a 120V outlet. It's also on >>>>>>> an extension cord. Anyone see anything like that before? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I suppose it's actually a 240V connector which is the same size as a >>>>>>> standard 120V connector but having one or more pins turned 90 >>>>>>> degrees. Still, those aren't very high current. >>>>>> >>>>>> Over here in Europe we have clothes dryers that use heat pumping >>>>>> instead of electric heating. They use like 700-1000W of power so >>>>>> they could easily work from a standard 120V socket. >>>>> >>>>> They no doubt save energy, but at what cost? They don't sound >>>>> economic. >>>>> >>>>> Sylvia. >>>> They make these portable dishwashers also, you can wash literally about >>>> 5 dishes in them: >>>> >>>> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttYboBVP0EE> >>>> >>>> I'm not so un-ameniable to "women's work" that I can't hand-wash 5 >>>> dishes and some knives and forks. Loading and programming the machine >>>> probably takes longer, anyway. >>> but it saves water and things get cleaner .. >> >> It saves how much water...? You can only save what is being used by >> hand washing which isn't much for five plates and some silver. If >> hand washing gets them clean, how can the washer get them "cleaner"? >> Is this like a volume control that goes to 11? >> > > I worked as a dish-washer in college; the plates and flatware were put > through an industrial-sized conveyor-belt dishwasher but the cookware > was scrubbed by hand by a small crew and then soaked in a tub of some > rather foul-smelling disinfectant (Iodophor) before a rinse and set out > to air-dry.As I recall there were some large stainless-steel triple sinks specifically for this process, there was the scrub-sink, the disinfectant-sink, and the rinse-sink.
Reply by ●October 5, 20212021-10-05
amdx <amdx@knology.net> writes:>> Assuming he's already normalized those 22 day figures to a 30 day month, >> that comes to $93.60/year. > > > $7.80 / 22 = $0.3545 per day x 365 days = $129.40 > > That's how I calculated it.$7.80 per month, extrapolated from 22 days of data. The boards only record from their power-on time and I don't bother digging into the archives. I even said "Monthly cost" right in the posting.
Reply by ●October 5, 20212021-10-05
On 10/4/2021 7:03 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:> tirsdag den 5. oktober 2021 kl. 00.38.00 UTC+2 skrev gnuarm.del...@gmail.com: >> On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 5:39:06 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: >>> mandag den 4. oktober 2021 kl. 23.22.19 UTC+2 skrev gnuarm.del...@gmail.com: >>>> On Monday, October 4, 2021 at 1:33:34 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: >>>>> mandag den 4. oktober 2021 kl. 19.27.55 UTC+2 skrev bitrex: >>>>>> On 10/4/2021 4:55 AM, Sylvia Else wrote: >>>>>>> On 04-Oct-21 7:27 pm, Rob wrote: >>>>>>>> Rick C <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>> The dryer here seems to be plugged into a 120V outlet. It's also on >>>>>>>>> an extension cord. Anyone see anything like that before? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I suppose it's actually a 240V connector which is the same size as a >>>>>>>>> standard 120V connector but having one or more pins turned 90 >>>>>>>>> degrees. Still, those aren't very high current. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Over here in Europe we have clothes dryers that use heat pumping >>>>>>>> instead of electric heating. They use like 700-1000W of power so >>>>>>>> they could easily work from a standard 120V socket. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> They no doubt save energy, but at what cost? They don't sound economic. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sylvia. >>>>>> They make these portable dishwashers also, you can wash literally about >>>>>> 5 dishes in them: >>>>>> >>>>>> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttYboBVP0EE> >>>>>> >>>>>> I'm not so un-ameniable to "women's work" that I can't hand-wash 5 >>>>>> dishes and some knives and forks. Loading and programming the machine >>>>>> probably takes longer, anyway. >>>>> but it saves water and things get cleaner .. >>>> It saves how much water...? You can only save what is being used by hand washing which isn't much for five plates and some silver. If hand washing gets them clean, how can the washer get them "cleaner"? Is this like a volume control that goes to 11? >>>> >>> do you have a dishwasher? try it >> Try what? How do I measure the water the dishwasher uses??? > > afaik it is required to use less than 5 gallons, EnergyStar ~3 gallons > those who tried it came to the conclusion that doing the same load by hand take 5-10 times as much > > and the water is hotter and the detergent more effective so the dishes get cleaner > >We're not talking about doing 50 dishes we're doing five! How could I use 15-30 gallons of water washing five dishes and some associated flatware. The detergent and elbow-grease does the bulk of the work you don't need to fill the whole fuckin' sink up for five dishes and five set forks spoons and knives, and let them sit in the tub of shit-ass dirty water while you "clean" them, damn.
Reply by ●October 5, 20212021-10-05
On 10/5/2021 7:19 AM, bitrex wrote:>> I worked as a dish-washer in college; the plates and flatware were put >> through an industrial-sized conveyor-belt dishwasher but the cookware was >> scrubbed by hand by a small crew and then soaked in a tub of some rather >> foul-smelling disinfectant (Iodophor) before a rinse and set out to air-dry. > > As I recall there were some large stainless-steel triple sinks specifically for > this process, there was the scrub-sink, the disinfectant-sink, and the rinse-sink.A mechanized dishwasher trades time and energy for cleanliness. In each case, it is reusing the water in a *closed* environment (e.g., hot water stays hot, longer than when running from your tap). Car washes recycle the water from the previous vehicles (that drain in the floor isn't connected to a sewer line but, rather, to a recirculating pump and filtration unit). In a house, you may never realize any savings -- esp in light of the cost of the appliance plus energy to power it. But, that's not true of all uses. We used to recycle glass in our curbside pickup (along with cardboard, paper, tin cans, certain types of plastic, etc. -- none of which was sorted by the "donor"). Recently, the city installed "glass drop-off points" around town. I don't know if this is because they felt they could get a better return on the glass or because the recycler decided it wasn't worth anything. But, now, instad of just screwing the cap back on the jar and cleaning any excess material off the outside (soas not to attract insects WHILE it remains in your posession, out-of-doors) and tossing it in a bin, you are now expected to *wash* the bottle's interior, dispose of the cap (meaning you now have an open bottle which, if not truly clean, is likely to attract insects), cache the bottles until you have enough for a special trip to a "glass drop-off point"... then, feed the bottles one-at-a-time through a small hole (into the 40yd rolloff!) -- to ensure you don't just drop whole bags of bottles into the collection box. The cost and effort (time + effort) required of the "donor" has now led to an increase in the amount of TRASH collected! Because so many folks just toss their glass bottles into the garbage, instead. Previously, the glass bottles could have been broken, the lids isolated, glass fragments washed and then crushed. And, the same water reused for that process -- instead of me watching it all run down the drain. [You've no doubt seen the photos of our regional water supply? <https://s.w-x.co/simwx/dru/2013/08/ca4997f9-23b6-44d4-af34-64680043f6cb_650x366.jpg> That "ring" is a drop of over 100 feet! What value saving glass at the expense of water?]
