On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 7:51:14 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote:> fredag den 15. april 2022 kl. 01.28.50 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: > > On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 4:20:03 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: > > > On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 6:42:19 PM UTC-4, Clifford Heath wrote: > > > > On 15/4/22 2:28 am, Ed Lee wrote: > > > > > On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 8:46:32 AM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: > > > > >> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 6:44:19 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: > > > > >>> torsdag den 14. april 2022 kl. 00.38.16 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: > > > > >>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 2:52:18 PM UTC-7, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: > > > > >>>>> onsdag den 13. april 2022 kl. 23.02.08 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: > > > > >>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:52:45 PM UTC-7, RichD wrote: > > > > >>>>>>> Today the electric cars are the quickest on the road. > > > > >>>>>>> The classic petrol muscle cars are vying for the silver medal. > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>> Was it obvious to the designers, from day one, > > > > >>>>>>> that this would be the case? Is it simply a power/weight calculation? > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > >>>>>>> I'm congenitally leery of simple explanations - > > > > >>>>>> For one thing, it's easier to install and control multiple motors. For maximum performance, you can put one (or more) motor per wheel, which is hard to do with ICE. > > > > >>>>> And electric motors can usually handle quite a lot of extra power short term > > > > >>>> I am thinking in terms of trucking. Perhaps 18 motors for 18 wheelers. Smaller distributed motors might work better for heavy cargo. > > > > >>> trucks are not fast, and most of the cargo is going to be batteries ... > > > > >> More FUD. Usually you post real information. What bee is up your bonnet about BEV trucks? > > > > > > > > > > Biggest problem is to maintain the current truck/driver model, where they are driving 8 to 10 hours of the same truck. In that case, we might need upward of 10,000 pounds of batteries. However, there are always shorter hauls where they can decouple the drivers with trucks/trailers, or go with hybrid diesel/EV. > > > > Read the link I sent. Standard prime movers are being retrofitted (in > > > > under a week!) with electric drive motors and quick-swap batteries. The > > > > trucks aren't limited by the geometry or aesthetics of a passenger car, > > > > so standardised interchangable batteries are easily achievable. > > > > > > > > The batteries are rented, so the owner just pays for the > > > > power+depreciation. Battery exchange/charging stations are being > > > > installed every few 100km along major highways. > > > I'm interested, but not enough to read through the fluff. Can you provide the pertinent facts? Are they talking about rechargeable batteries or primary cells, like aluminum-air? > > $120,000 6 cu.m(est) 1500lbs (est) 100kwhr (guess) > > > > They claim 300 miles range, but i really doubt it for fully loaded truck. > modern 40 ton diesel trucks average something like ~4km/l > a liter of diesel is ~10kWhThat liter of diesel will get you 2.5 to 3 miles. 10 kWh will get you 5 miles according to Tesla. 100 kWh, 500 miles. To Ed, It is silly to think they are providing fuel consumption data for anything other than a fully loaded truck. The people they are providing data to aren't stupid. -- Rick C. ---- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging ---- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
Tesla is fast
Started by ●April 13, 2022
Reply by ●April 14, 20222022-04-14
Reply by ●April 15, 20222022-04-15
On 15/4/22 11:57 am, Ricky wrote:> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 7:48:23 PM UTC-4, Clifford Heath wrote: >> On 15/4/22 9:19 am, Ricky wrote: >>> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 6:42:19 PM UTC-4, Clifford Heath wrote: >>>> On 15/4/22 2:28 am, Ed Lee wrote: >>>>> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 8:46:32 AM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: >>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 6:44:19 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: >>>>>>> torsdag den 14. april 2022 kl. 00.38.16 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: >>>>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 2:52:18 PM UTC-7, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: >>>>>>>>> onsdag den 13. april 2022 kl. 23.02.08 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: >>>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:52:45 PM UTC-7, RichD wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Today the electric cars are the quickest on the road. >>>>>>>>>>> The classic petrol muscle cars are vying for the silver medal. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Was it obvious to the designers, from day one, >>>>>>>>>>> that this would be the case? Is it simply a power/weight calculation? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I'm congenitally leery of simple explanations - >>>>>>>>>> For one thing, it's easier to install and control multiple motors. For maximum performance, you can put one (or more) motor per wheel, which is hard to do with ICE. >>>>>>>>> And electric motors can usually handle quite a lot of extra power short term >>>>>>>> I am thinking in terms of trucking. Perhaps 18 motors for 18 wheelers. Smaller distributed motors might work better for heavy cargo. >>>>>>> trucks are not fast, and most of the cargo is going to be batteries ... >>>>>> More FUD. Usually you post real information. What bee is up your bonnet about BEV trucks? >>>>> >>>>> Biggest problem is to maintain the current truck/driver model, where they are driving 8 to 10 hours of the same truck. In that case, we might need upward of 10,000 pounds of batteries. However, there are always shorter hauls where they can decouple the drivers with trucks/trailers, or go with hybrid diesel/EV. >>>> Read the link I sent. Standard prime movers are being retrofitted (in >>>> under a week!) with electric drive motors and quick-swap batteries. The >>>> trucks aren't limited by the geometry or aesthetics of a passenger car, >>>> so standardised interchangable batteries are easily achievable. >>>> >>>> The batteries are rented, so the owner just pays for the >>>> power+depreciation. Battery exchange/charging stations are being >>>> installed every few 100km along major highways. >>> >>> I'm interested, but not enough to read through the fluff. Can you provide the pertinent facts? Are they talking about rechargeable batteries or primary cells, like aluminum-air? >>> >> Rechargable. Currently Lithium, but the module form factor is designed >> to adapt to likely new chemistries. The important point is the drive >> motor and battery fits into the existing motor cavity and fuel tank >> locations, so there is no structural modification required. >> >> The conversion cost is equivalent to rebuilding or replacing the diesel, >> and the operating cost per kilometre a little over half, and service >> costs also significantly reduced. >> >> <https://www.januselectric.com.au/#:~:text=Interchangeable%20Parts> > > I suppose a battery swap might be more useful for a truck than for cars. But there are issues with scheduling. When a truck has a delivery, that delivery has a schedule. You arrive by the time of your dock appointment or you lose it. I would expect battery swaps to be the same way. So an appointment is made in advance and what do we do to make sure we arrive in time for appointments? We arrive early. The whole point of the battery swap is to reduce wasted time charging. So how does it help to have to arrive 15 to 30 minutes early to make sure of meeting the appointment, vs. simply spending 45 minutes to charge? > > It's hard to imagine a battery swap for trucks that is so rapid that no appointment is needed. But maybe that's just the limit of my imagination.It's not that hard to read the damn FAQs, is it? The answer is 3 minutes (which took me about 3 seconds to find): <https://www.januselectric.com.au/#:~:text=How%20does> "The Janus Electric software manages the time availability of charged batteries."> Comparing to fueling up or charging, the battery swap is going to require trained personnel and something that may be a bit on the fancy side to swap out the battery. I don't know if that will be a significant factor in the cost of the service or not. > > The main issue will likely be the company itself. You are limited to working with one outfit, serving how large an area? They can even fold.For an e-power enthusiast, you're very full of reasons why it won't work. Yet you bleat so loudly when people act the same way about Tesla's. CH
Reply by ●April 15, 20222022-04-15
On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 7:06:47 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 7:51:14 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: > > fredag den 15. april 2022 kl. 01.28.50 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: > > > On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 4:20:03 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: > > > > On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 6:42:19 PM UTC-4, Clifford Heath wrote: > > > > > On 15/4/22 2:28 am, Ed Lee wrote: > > > > > > On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 8:46:32 AM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: > > > > > >> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 6:44:19 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: > > > > > >>> torsdag den 14. april 2022 kl. 00.38.16 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: > > > > > >>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 2:52:18 PM UTC-7, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: > > > > > >>>>> onsdag den 13. april 2022 kl. 23.02.08 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: > > > > > >>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:52:45 PM UTC-7, RichD wrote: > > > > > >>>>>>> Today the electric cars are the quickest on the road. > > > > > >>>>>>> The classic petrol muscle cars are vying for the silver medal. > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> Was it obvious to the designers, from day one, > > > > > >>>>>>> that this would be the case? Is it simply a power/weight calculation? > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > >>>>>>> I'm congenitally leery of simple explanations - > > > > > >>>>>> For one thing, it's easier to install and control multiple motors. For maximum performance, you can put one (or more) motor per wheel, which is hard to do with ICE. > > > > > >>>>> And electric motors can usually handle quite a lot of extra power short term > > > > > >>>> I am thinking in terms of trucking. Perhaps 18 motors for 18 wheelers. Smaller distributed motors might work better for heavy cargo. > > > > > >>> trucks are not fast, and most of the cargo is going to be batteries ... > > > > > >> More FUD. Usually you post real information. What bee is up your bonnet about BEV trucks? > > > > > > > > > > > > Biggest problem is to maintain the current truck/driver model, where they are driving 8 to 10 hours of the same truck. In that case, we might need upward of 10,000 pounds of batteries. However, there are always shorter hauls where they can decouple the drivers with trucks/trailers, or go with hybrid diesel/EV. > > > > > Read the link I sent. Standard prime movers are being retrofitted (in > > > > > under a week!) with electric drive motors and quick-swap batteries. The > > > > > trucks aren't limited by the geometry or aesthetics of a passenger car, > > > > > so standardised interchangable batteries are easily achievable. > > > > > > > > > > The batteries are rented, so the owner just pays for the > > > > > power+depreciation. Battery exchange/charging stations are being > > > > > installed every few 100km along major highways. > > > > I'm interested, but not enough to read through the fluff. Can you provide the pertinent facts? Are they talking about rechargeable batteries or primary cells, like aluminum-air? > > > $120,000 6 cu.m(est) 1500lbs (est) 100kwhr (guess) > > > > > > They claim 300 miles range, but i really doubt it for fully loaded truck. > > modern 40 ton diesel trucks average something like ~4km/l > > a liter of diesel is ~10kWh > That liter of diesel will get you 2.5 to 3 miles. 10 kWh will get you 5 miles according to Tesla. 100 kWh, 500 miles.That's for burning. But diesel engine is around 30% to 50% efficient for moving. 10kWh will get you 2 to 3 miles.> To Ed, It is silly to think they are providing fuel consumption data for anything other than a fully loaded truck. The people they are providing data to aren't stupid.Now, you are being silly with your data.
Reply by ●April 15, 20222022-04-15
On Friday, April 15, 2022 at 1:15:48 AM UTC-7, Ed Lee wrote:> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 7:06:47 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: > > On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 7:51:14 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: > > > fredag den 15. april 2022 kl. 01.28.50 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: > > > > On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 4:20:03 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: > > > > > On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 6:42:19 PM UTC-4, Clifford Heath wrote: > > > > > > On 15/4/22 2:28 am, Ed Lee wrote: > > > > > > > On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 8:46:32 AM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: > > > > > > >> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 6:44:19 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: > > > > > > >>> torsdag den 14. april 2022 kl. 00.38.16 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: > > > > > > >>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 2:52:18 PM UTC-7, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: > > > > > > >>>>> onsdag den 13. april 2022 kl. 23.02.08 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: > > > > > > >>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:52:45 PM UTC-7, RichD wrote: > > > > > > >>>>>>> Today the electric cars are the quickest on the road. > > > > > > >>>>>>> The classic petrol muscle cars are vying for the silver medal. > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>> Was it obvious to the designers, from day one, > > > > > > >>>>>>> that this would be the case? Is it simply a power/weight calculation? > > > > > > >>>>>>> > > > > > > >>>>>>> I'm congenitally leery of simple explanations - > > > > > > >>>>>> For one thing, it's easier to install and control multiple motors. For maximum performance, you can put one (or more) motor per wheel, which is hard to do with ICE. > > > > > > >>>>> And electric motors can usually handle quite a lot of extra power short term > > > > > > >>>> I am thinking in terms of trucking. Perhaps 18 motors for 18 wheelers. Smaller distributed motors might work better for heavy cargo. > > > > > > >>> trucks are not fast, and most of the cargo is going to be batteries ... > > > > > > >> More FUD. Usually you post real information. What bee is up your bonnet about BEV trucks? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Biggest problem is to maintain the current truck/driver model, where they are driving 8 to 10 hours of the same truck. In that case, we might need upward of 10,000 pounds of batteries. However, there are always shorter hauls where they can decouple the drivers with trucks/trailers, or go with hybrid diesel/EV. > > > > > > Read the link I sent. Standard prime movers are being retrofitted (in > > > > > > under a week!) with electric drive motors and quick-swap batteries. The > > > > > > trucks aren't limited by the geometry or aesthetics of a passenger car, > > > > > > so standardised interchangable batteries are easily achievable. > > > > > > > > > > > > The batteries are rented, so the owner just pays for the > > > > > > power+depreciation. Battery exchange/charging stations are being > > > > > > installed every few 100km along major highways. > > > > > I'm interested, but not enough to read through the fluff. Can you provide the pertinent facts? Are they talking about rechargeable batteries or primary cells, like aluminum-air? > > > > $120,000 6 cu.m(est) 1500lbs (est) 100kwhr (guess) > > > > > > > > They claim 300 miles range, but i really doubt it for fully loaded truck. > > > modern 40 ton diesel trucks average something like ~4km/l > > > a liter of diesel is ~10kWh > > That liter of diesel will get you 2.5 to 3 miles. 10 kWh will get you 5 miles according to Tesla. 100 kWh, 500 miles. > That's for burning. But diesel engine is around 30% to 50% efficient for moving. 10kWh will get you 2 to 3 miles.3kWh (30% of 10kWh) will get 2 to 3 miles, or less than 1 mile per kWh> > To Ed, It is silly to think they are providing fuel consumption data for anything other than a fully loaded truck. The people they are providing data to aren't stupid. > Now, you are being silly with your data.
Reply by ●April 15, 20222022-04-15
On 2022-04-15, Ricky <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 7:48:23 PM UTC-4, Clifford Heath wrote: >> On 15/4/22 9:19 am, Ricky wrote: >> > On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 6:42:19 PM UTC-4, Clifford Heath wrote: >> >> On 15/4/22 2:28 am, Ed Lee wrote: >> >>> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 8:46:32 AM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: >> >>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 6:44:19 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: >> >>>>> torsdag den 14. april 2022 kl. 00.38.16 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: >> >>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 2:52:18 PM UTC-7, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: >> >>>>>>> onsdag den 13. april 2022 kl. 23.02.08 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: >> >>>>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:52:45 PM UTC-7, RichD wrote: >> >>>>>>>>> Today the electric cars are the quickest on the road. >> >>>>>>>>> The classic petrol muscle cars are vying for the silver medal. >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> Was it obvious to the designers, from day one, >> >>>>>>>>> that this would be the case? Is it simply a power/weight calculation? >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> I'm congenitally leery of simple explanations - >> >>>>>>>> For one thing, it's easier to install and control multiple motors. For maximum performance, you can put one (or more) motor per wheel, which is hard to do with ICE. >> >>>>>>> And electric motors can usually handle quite a lot of extra power short term >> >>>>>> I am thinking in terms of trucking. Perhaps 18 motors for 18 wheelers. Smaller distributed motors might work better for heavy cargo. >> >>>>> trucks are not fast, and most of the cargo is going to be batteries ... >> >>>> More FUD. Usually you post real information. What bee is up your bonnet about BEV trucks? >> >>> >> >>> Biggest problem is to maintain the current truck/driver model, where they are driving 8 to 10 hours of the same truck. In that case, we might need upward of 10,000 pounds of batteries. However, there are always shorter hauls where they can decouple the drivers with trucks/trailers, or go with hybrid diesel/EV. >> >> Read the link I sent. Standard prime movers are being retrofitted (in >> >> under a week!) with electric drive motors and quick-swap batteries. The >> >> trucks aren't limited by the geometry or aesthetics of a passenger car, >> >> so standardised interchangable batteries are easily achievable. >> >> >> >> The batteries are rented, so the owner just pays for the >> >> power+depreciation. Battery exchange/charging stations are being >> >> installed every few 100km along major highways. >> > >> > I'm interested, but not enough to read through the fluff. Can you provide the pertinent facts? Are they talking about rechargeable batteries or primary cells, like aluminum-air? >> > >> Rechargable. Currently Lithium, but the module form factor is designed >> to adapt to likely new chemistries. The important point is the drive >> motor and battery fits into the existing motor cavity and fuel tank >> locations, so there is no structural modification required. >> >> The conversion cost is equivalent to rebuilding or replacing the diesel, >> and the operating cost per kilometre a little over half, and service >> costs also significantly reduced. >> >> <https://www.januselectric.com.au/#:~:text=Interchangeable%20Parts> > > I suppose a battery swap might be more useful for a truck than for cars. But there are issues with scheduling. When a truck has a delivery, that delivery has a schedule. You arrive by the time of your dock appointment or you lose it. I would expect battery swaps to be the same way. So an appointment is made in advance and what do we do to make sure we arrive in time for appointments? We arrive early. The whole point of the battery swap is to reduce wasted time charging. So how does it help to have to arrive 15 to 30 minutes early to make sure of meeting the appointment, vs. simply spending 45 minutes to charge? > > It's hard to imagine a battery swap for trucks that is so rapid that > no appointment is needed. But maybe that's just the limit of my > imagination.I can't see it being significantly slower than swapping trailers. drive into position, unplug the cables, release the clamps, whistle for a fork-lift, crane, or whatever.> The main issue will likely be the company itself. You are limited > to working with one outfit, serving how large an area? They can even > fold.yeah, it's a risk if you're stuck with a single provider. -- Jasen.
Reply by ●April 15, 20222022-04-15
Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:> fredag den 15. april 2022 kl. 01.28.50 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: >> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 4:20:03 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: >>> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 6:42:19 PM UTC-4, Clifford Heath wrote: >>>> On 15/4/22 2:28 am, Ed Lee wrote: >>>>> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 8:46:32 AM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: >>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 6:44:19 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: >>>>>>> torsdag den 14. april 2022 kl. 00.38.16 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: >>>>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 2:52:18 PM UTC-7, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: >>>>>>>>> onsdag den 13. april 2022 kl. 23.02.08 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: >>>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:52:45 PM UTC-7, RichD wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Today the electric cars are the quickest on the road. >>>>>>>>>>> The classic petrol muscle cars are vying for the silver medal. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Was it obvious to the designers, from day one, >>>>>>>>>>> that this would be the case? Is it simply a power/weight calculation? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I'm congenitally leery of simple explanations - >>>>>>>>>> For one thing, it's easier to install and control multiple motors. For maximum performance, you can put one (or more) motor per wheel, which is hard to do with ICE. >>>>>>>>> And electric motors can usually handle quite a lot of extra power short term >>>>>>>> I am thinking in terms of trucking. Perhaps 18 motors for 18 wheelers. Smaller distributed motors might work better for heavy cargo. >>>>>>> trucks are not fast, and most of the cargo is going to be batteries ... >>>>>> More FUD. Usually you post real information. What bee is up your bonnet about BEV trucks? >>>>> >>>>> Biggest problem is to maintain the current truck/driver model, where they are driving 8 to 10 hours of the same truck. In that case, we might need upward of 10,000 pounds of batteries. However, there are always shorter hauls where they can decouple the drivers with trucks/trailers, or go with hybrid diesel/EV. >>>> Read the link I sent. Standard prime movers are being retrofitted (in >>>> under a week!) with electric drive motors and quick-swap batteries. The >>>> trucks aren't limited by the geometry or aesthetics of a passenger car, >>>> so standardised interchangable batteries are easily achievable. >>>> >>>> The batteries are rented, so the owner just pays for the >>>> power+depreciation. Battery exchange/charging stations are being >>>> installed every few 100km along major highways. >>> I'm interested, but not enough to read through the fluff. Can you provide the pertinent facts? Are they talking about rechargeable batteries or primary cells, like aluminum-air? >> $120,000 6 cu.m(est) 1500lbs (est) 100kwhr (guess) >> >> They claim 300 miles range, but i really doubt it for fully loaded truck. > > modern 40 ton diesel trucks average something like ~4km/l > a liter of diesel is ~10kWhIn Denmark or Holland or Florida, maybe. In Switzerland or Colorado, not so much. ;) Cheers Phil Hobbs -- Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 http://electrooptical.net http://hobbs-eo.com
Reply by ●April 15, 20222022-04-15
On Friday, April 15, 2022 at 6:27:50 AM UTC-7, Phil Hobbs wrote:> Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote: > > fredag den 15. april 2022 kl. 01.28.50 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: > >> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 4:20:03 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: > >>> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 6:42:19 PM UTC-4, Clifford Heath wrote: > >>>> On 15/4/22 2:28 am, Ed Lee wrote: > >>>>> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 8:46:32 AM UTC-7, Ricky wrote: > >>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 6:44:19 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: > >>>>>>> torsdag den 14. april 2022 kl. 00.38.16 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: > >>>>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 2:52:18 PM UTC-7, lang...@fonz.dk wrote: > >>>>>>>>> onsdag den 13. april 2022 kl. 23.02.08 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: > >>>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:52:45 PM UTC-7, RichD wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> Today the electric cars are the quickest on the road. > >>>>>>>>>>> The classic petrol muscle cars are vying for the silver medal. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> Was it obvious to the designers, from day one, > >>>>>>>>>>> that this would be the case? Is it simply a power/weight calculation? > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> I'm congenitally leery of simple explanations - > >>>>>>>>>> For one thing, it's easier to install and control multiple motors. For maximum performance, you can put one (or more) motor per wheel, which is hard to do with ICE. > >>>>>>>>> And electric motors can usually handle quite a lot of extra power short term > >>>>>>>> I am thinking in terms of trucking. Perhaps 18 motors for 18 wheelers. Smaller distributed motors might work better for heavy cargo. > >>>>>>> trucks are not fast, and most of the cargo is going to be batteries ... > >>>>>> More FUD. Usually you post real information. What bee is up your bonnet about BEV trucks? > >>>>> > >>>>> Biggest problem is to maintain the current truck/driver model, where they are driving 8 to 10 hours of the same truck. In that case, we might need upward of 10,000 pounds of batteries. However, there are always shorter hauls where they can decouple the drivers with trucks/trailers, or go with hybrid diesel/EV. > >>>> Read the link I sent. Standard prime movers are being retrofitted (in > >>>> under a week!) with electric drive motors and quick-swap batteries. The > >>>> trucks aren't limited by the geometry or aesthetics of a passenger car, > >>>> so standardised interchangable batteries are easily achievable. > >>>> > >>>> The batteries are rented, so the owner just pays for the > >>>> power+depreciation. Battery exchange/charging stations are being > >>>> installed every few 100km along major highways. > >>> I'm interested, but not enough to read through the fluff. Can you provide the pertinent facts? Are they talking about rechargeable batteries or primary cells, like aluminum-air? > >> $120,000 6 cu.m(est) 1500lbs (est) 100kwhr (guess) > >> > >> They claim 300 miles range, but i really doubt it for fully loaded truck. > > > > modern 40 ton diesel trucks average something like ~4km/l > > a liter of diesel is ~10kWh > In Denmark or Holland or Florida, maybe. In Switzerland or Colorado, > not so much. ;)For us imperialist: 4 * 3.78 * 0.62 = 9.37 miles per gal. That's pretty good. We used to deal with 5 to 6 mpg for big trucks. 30% of 37.8kWhr (1 gal) for moving is 9.37 miles for 12 kWhr or around 0.8 mile per kWhr.
Reply by ●April 15, 20222022-04-15
On 4/14/2022 4:24 PM, Ricky wrote:> On Thursday, April 14, 2022 at 4:53:33 PM UTC-4, amdx wrote: >> On 4/13/2022 4:52 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote: >>> onsdag den 13. april 2022 kl. 23.02.08 UTC+2 skrev Ed Lee: >>>> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:52:45 PM UTC-7, RichD wrote: >>>>> Today the electric cars are the quickest on the road. >>>>> The classic petrol muscle cars are vying for the silver medal. >>>>> >>>>> Was it obvious to the designers, from day one, >>>>> that this would be the case? Is it simply a power/weight calculation? >>>>> >>>>> I'm congenitally leery of simple explanations - >>>> For one thing, it's easier to install and control multiple motors. For maximum performance, you can put one (or more) motor per wheel, which is hard to do with ICE. >>> And electric motors can usually handle quite a lot of extra power short term >> Yep, I put a 2hp 28V motor on a go Kart. 2HP = 1492 watts/28V = 53 amps. >> But I ran it on 48v and the 250 amp meter pegged on acceleration. >> 48v x 250 = 12,000 watts. 12,000 / 746 = 16 HP. We could run it a full speed >> 40mph without any heat problems, but by the time you got to full speed >> the current >> had dropped way down. > Many years ago some guys from a car magazine tried making a dragster out of a mail jeep and an electric motor, DC commutator I believe. They had a little trouble with the commutator I believe, but the ultimate problem was they used a cog belt drive, and kept shredding the belts! I guess no one tried doing any math to see what the forces would be. > At one time I took it to a local marina where there were several guys. One heavy guy got on, he nailed it and took every tooth of my motor sprocket! Easy fix, I had on at home. So, ya, torque up the wazoo! Mikek -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Reply by ●April 15, 20222022-04-15
On 4/13/2022 10:34 PM, DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org wrote:> Ed Lee <edward.ming.lee@gmail.com> wrote in > news:a42b2143-d5b6-4eec-a2a1-da348c1ee3aen@googlegroups.com: > >> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:52:45 PM UTC-7, RichD wrote: >>> Today the electric cars are the quickest on the road. >>> The classic petrol muscle cars are vying for the silver medal. >>> >>> Was it obvious to the designers, from day one, >>> that this would be the case? Is it simply a power/weight >>> calculation? >>> >>> I'm congenitally leery of simple explanations - >> For one thing, it's easier to install and control multiple motors. >> For maximum performance, you can put one (or more) motor per >> wheel, which is hard to do with ICE. >> >> > For one thing you are being presumptuous... again. Not very > bright. > > <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjhGSy5pCJA>Seems all show and no go. 6 years on Youtube and not a single comment, you can be the first! -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Reply by ●April 15, 20222022-04-15
On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 22:02:03 +0100, Ed Lee <edward.ming.lee@gmail.com> wrote:> On Wednesday, April 13, 2022 at 12:52:45 PM UTC-7, RichD wrote: >> Today the electric cars are the quickest on the road. >> The classic petrol muscle cars are vying for the silver medal. >> >> Was it obvious to the designers, from day one, >> that this would be the case? Is it simply a power/weight calculation? >> >> I'm congenitally leery of simple explanations - > > For one thing, it's easier to install and control multiple motors. For maximum performance, you can put one (or more) motor per wheel, which is hard to do with ICE.When did ICE start meaning Internal Combustion Engine and not In Car Entertainment? Classified ads always said ICE if it had a good stereo.
