I need to mount (many) RGB indicators at right angle to the PCB (i.e., so the light travels parallel to the plane of the PCB) The entire assembly needs to be *really* thin. Using SMT components, it seems like I'd have to use lightpipes to bend the light (typically emitted normal to the PCB). This will add to the thickness of the assembly (board thickness + component + pipe) A better approach might be to use leaded components mounted on their sides AT the edge of the PCB and selecting them for smallest diameter possible (as this would conceivably be the largest dimension in the assembly's thickness). I'm looking for ~100K qty (LEDs) and can provide my own drive electronics (I looked at the "RGB LEDs with integrated drivers" and came up lacking). Another alternative might be SMT devices shining *through* the PBC into pipes -- the thickness of the PCB offsetting some of the required "height" of the pipe as it navigates its bend) I can't think of any other alternatives...
right angle RGB leds
Started by ●October 8, 2023
Reply by ●October 8, 20232023-10-08
On 08/10/2023 12:08, Don Y wrote:> I need to mount (many) RGB indicators at right angle > to the PCB (i.e., so the light travels parallel to the > plane of the PCB) > > The entire assembly needs to be *really* thin. > > Using SMT components, it seems like I'd have to use > lightpipes to bend the light (typically emitted normal > to the PCB). This will add to the thickness of the assembly > (board thickness + component + pipe)<snip> Right angle RGB SM LED, first one found... https://www.digikey.co.uk/en/products/detail/everlight-electronics-co-ltd/EASV3015RGBA0/6156087 -- Cheers Clive
Reply by ●October 8, 20232023-10-08
On 2023-10-08, Don Y wrote:> I need to mount (many) RGB indicators at right angle > to the PCB (i.e., so the light travels parallel to the > plane of the PCB) > > The entire assembly needs to be *really* thin. > > [...] > I'm looking for ~100K qty (LEDs) and can provide my own > drive electronics (I looked at the "RGB LEDs with integrated > drivers" and came up lacking).Digikey has the Inolux IN-PI42TASPRPGPB [1] (but only 47k on hand, 8 week mfg lead time). 2mm tall right-angle addressable (1-wire) things, and a quick spin through the datasheet shows the timing to be pretty much the same as the WS2812 or SK6812 options (aka "Neopixel", if you're familiar with Adafruit / Sparkfun). Mouser *probably* has something too, but their search / drilldown is godawful, and I gave up. [1] https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/inolux/IN-PI42TASPRPGPB/9681236 -- |_|O|_| |_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert |O|O|O| PGP: DDAB 23FB 19FA 7D85 1CC1 E067 6D65 70E5 4CE7 2860
Reply by ●October 8, 20232023-10-08
ThereOn Sun, 8 Oct 2023 04:08:55 -0700, Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:>I need to mount (many) RGB indicators at right angle >to the PCB (i.e., so the light travels parallel to the >plane of the PCB) > >The entire assembly needs to be *really* thin. > >Using SMT components, it seems like I'd have to use >lightpipes to bend the light (typically emitted normal >to the PCB). This will add to the thickness of the assembly >(board thickness + component + pipe) > >A better approach might be to use leaded components >mounted on their sides AT the edge of the PCB and >selecting them for smallest diameter possible (as >this would conceivably be the largest dimension in the >assembly's thickness). > >I'm looking for ~100K qty (LEDs) and can provide my own >drive electronics (I looked at the "RGB LEDs with integrated >drivers" and came up lacking). > >Another alternative might be SMT devices shining *through* >the PBC into pipes -- the thickness of the PCB offsetting >some of the required "height" of the pipe as it navigates >its bend) > >I can't think of any other alternatives...There are lots of surface-mount RA RGB LEDs, like this one. https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/everlight-electronics-co-ltd/EASV3015RGBA0/6156087 It's not always obvious from their datasheets that this style actually shoots light parallel to the PCB. Wurth has some similar parts but Wurth makes terrible data sheets.
Reply by ●October 8, 20232023-10-08
On 10/8/2023 4:26 AM, Clive Arthur wrote:> On 08/10/2023 12:08, Don Y wrote: >> I need to mount (many) RGB indicators at right angle >> to the PCB (i.e., so the light travels parallel to the >> plane of the PCB) >> >> The entire assembly needs to be *really* thin. >> >> Using SMT components, it seems like I'd have to use >> lightpipes to bend the light (typically emitted normal >> to the PCB). This will add to the thickness of the assembly >> (board thickness + component + pipe) > > <snip> > > Right angle RGB SM LED, first one found... > > https://www.digikey.co.uk/en/products/detail/everlight-electronics-co-ltd/EASV3015RGBA0/6156087I'm confused by the datasheet's dimensioning; on page 8, it appears that the "dome" portion stands UP from the board instead of lying on it. (i.e., the second illustration is labeled "Side" when one would think it should be "Top"?) So, I'm wondering what the height of the device is (given that it has to sit *on* a PCB so the thickness of the board adds to the assembly's thickness -- that's the problem with anything mounted *on* the board hoping to cast light off to the side)
Reply by ●October 8, 20232023-10-08
On 10/8/2023 4:32 AM, Dan Purgert wrote:> On 2023-10-08, Don Y wrote: >> I need to mount (many) RGB indicators at right angle >> to the PCB (i.e., so the light travels parallel to the >> plane of the PCB) >> >> The entire assembly needs to be *really* thin. >> >> [...] >> I'm looking for ~100K qty (LEDs) and can provide my own >> drive electronics (I looked at the "RGB LEDs with integrated >> drivers" and came up lacking). > > Digikey has the Inolux IN-PI42TASPRPGPB [1] (but only 47k on hand, 8 > week mfg lead time).I only need 1K on-hand for prototypes; someone else can deal with the larger order.> 2mm tall right-angle addressable (1-wire) things, > and a quick spin through the datasheet shows the timing to be pretty > much the same as the WS2812 or SK6812 options (aka "Neopixel", if you're > familiar with Adafruit / Sparkfun).The internal driver is a win (I'd have to check to see if it has the "problems" of the original 2812) as it saves some components and board space. But, board space is easier to come by than assembly *thickness*. :< 2mm on top of a ~1.5mm board brings me to 3.5mm. Then, encapsulation adds to this. (I'd have to see if I can reduce the thickness of the PCB substrate) I was hoping for 2.5mm before encapsulation; the advantage of a leaded component soldered on the edge meant that the board's thickness falls out of the calculus. [I can't imagine how to package an SMT device so that the die has access to the pads and can still emit light on that same plane!]> Mouser *probably* has something too, but their search / drilldown is > godawful, and I gave up.F*ck Mouser.> [1] https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/inolux/IN-PI42TASPRPGPB/9681236Thanks, I'll have to see where I can trim some other thickness out of the design without sacrificing mechanical strength. [I should buy some just to play with. Ditto the units Clive recommended if only to sort out the dimensions from the datasheet]
Reply by ●October 8, 20232023-10-08
On Monday, October 9, 2023 at 12:45:37 AM UTC+11, Don Y wrote:> On 10/8/2023 4:26 AM, Clive Arthur wrote: > > On 08/10/2023 12:08, Don Y wrote:<snip>> https://www.digikey.co.uk/en/products/detail/everlight-electronics-co-ltd/EASV3015RGBA0/6156087lets you download the datasheet, and on page 8 the second drawing on the left hand side of the page shows the peak height of the dome as 1.5+/-0.1mm That doesn't seem to include any solder filet under the device. Presumably the LEDs shoot sideways out of the side of the dome.> I'm confused by the datasheet's dimensioning; on page 8, it appears that the "dome" portion stands UP from the board instead of lying on it. (i.e., the second illustration is labeled "Side" when one would think it should be "Top"?)The dome doesn't seem to be any kind of lens but rather just a flattened blob over the the three-LED assembly.> So, I'm wondering what the height of the device is (given that it has to sit *on* a PCB so the thickness of the board adds to the assembly's thickness -- that's the problem with anything mounted *on* the board hoping to cast light off to the side).The manufacturer has no control over the thickness and nature of the "board" to which the device is soldered. You could put it on metallised alumina for all they care. -- Bill Sloman, Sydney
Reply by ●October 8, 20232023-10-08
søndag den 8. oktober 2023 kl. 15.45.37 UTC+2 skrev Don Y:> On 10/8/2023 4:26 AM, Clive Arthur wrote: > > On 08/10/2023 12:08, Don Y wrote: > >> I need to mount (many) RGB indicators at right angle > >> to the PCB (i.e., so the light travels parallel to the > >> plane of the PCB) > >> > >> The entire assembly needs to be *really* thin. > >> > >> Using SMT components, it seems like I'd have to use > >> lightpipes to bend the light (typically emitted normal > >> to the PCB). This will add to the thickness of the assembly > >> (board thickness + component + pipe) > > > > <snip> > > > > Right angle RGB SM LED, first one found... > > > > https://www.digikey.co.uk/en/products/detail/everlight-electronics-co-ltd/EASV3015RGBA0/6156087 > I'm confused by the datasheet's dimensioning; on page 8, it appears > that the "dome" portion stands UP from the board instead of lying > on it. (i.e., the second illustration is labeled "Side" when > one would think it should be "Top"?)bottom right shows it mounted drawing says 1mm, how thin do you need? 0.7mm https://www.digikey.co.uk/en/products/detail/sunled/XZCBDMEDGK161W/8259045 https://www.digikey.co.uk/en/products/detail/sunled/XZCCBDMEDGK161W/10449771
Reply by ●October 8, 20232023-10-08
On Sun, 8 Oct 2023 06:45:26 -0700, Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:>On 10/8/2023 4:26 AM, Clive Arthur wrote: >> On 08/10/2023 12:08, Don Y wrote: >>> I need to mount (many) RGB indicators at right angle >>> to the PCB (i.e., so the light travels parallel to the >>> plane of the PCB) >>> >>> The entire assembly needs to be *really* thin. >>> >>> Using SMT components, it seems like I'd have to use >>> lightpipes to bend the light (typically emitted normal >>> to the PCB).� This will add to the thickness of the assembly >>> (board thickness + component + pipe) >> >> <snip> >> >> Right angle RGB SM LED, first one found... >> >> https://www.digikey.co.uk/en/products/detail/everlight-electronics-co-ltd/EASV3015RGBA0/6156087 > >I'm confused by the datasheet's dimensioning; on page 8, it appears >that the "dome" portion stands UP from the board instead of lying >on it. (i.e., the second illustration is labeled "Side" when >one would think it should be "Top"?) > >So, I'm wondering what the height of the device is (given that >it has to sit *on* a PCB so the thickness of the board adds >to the assembly's thickness -- that's the problem with anything >mounted *on* the board hoping to cast light off to the side) >Terrible data sheet. It actually mounts "on its side", shooting light parallel to the board. Soldering will be tricky. We use similar parts on some of our boards. Here's our experiment. https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/p03zpedrlkiudimfzrmot/h?rlkey=myk6loks5uhyxw5ahis3lic8p&dl=0 We used little mushroom light pipes to improve viewing angles. They look nice too. That led could also be mounted on the *edge* of a board, which would get really interesting.
Reply by ●October 8, 20232023-10-08
søndag den 8. oktober 2023 kl. 18.42.19 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:> On Sun, 8 Oct 2023 06:45:26 -0700, Don Y <blocked...@foo.invalid> > wrote: > >On 10/8/2023 4:26 AM, Clive Arthur wrote: > >> On 08/10/2023 12:08, Don Y wrote: > >>> I need to mount (many) RGB indicators at right angle > >>> to the PCB (i.e., so the light travels parallel to the > >>> plane of the PCB) > >>> > >>> The entire assembly needs to be *really* thin. > >>> > >>> Using SMT components, it seems like I'd have to use > >>> lightpipes to bend the light (typically emitted normal > >>> to the PCB). This will add to the thickness of the assembly > >>> (board thickness + component + pipe) > >> > >> <snip> > >> > >> Right angle RGB SM LED, first one found... > >> > >> https://www.digikey.co.uk/en/products/detail/everlight-electronics-co-ltd/EASV3015RGBA0/6156087 > > > >I'm confused by the datasheet's dimensioning; on page 8, it appears > >that the "dome" portion stands UP from the board instead of lying > >on it. (i.e., the second illustration is labeled "Side" when > >one would think it should be "Top"?) > > > >So, I'm wondering what the height of the device is (given that > >it has to sit *on* a PCB so the thickness of the board adds > >to the assembly's thickness -- that's the problem with anything > >mounted *on* the board hoping to cast light off to the side) > > > Terrible data sheet. It actually mounts "on its side", shooting light > parallel to the board. Soldering will be tricky. We use similar parts > on some of our boards. > > Here's our experiment. > > https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/p03zpedrlkiudimfzrmot/h?rlkey=myk6loks5uhyxw5ahis3lic8p&dl=0 > > We used little mushroom light pipes to improve viewing angles. They > look nice too. > > That led could also be mounted on the *edge* of a board, which would > get really interesting.would have to done manually, so might as well use regular through hole LEDs like this http://mnats.net/fet500.html
