Customer Credit and Late Payment Fees

On Sunday, October 10, 2021 at 12:36:04 AM UTC-4, gnuarm.del...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Saturday, October 9, 2021 at 11:42:37 PM UTC-4, terrell....@gmail.com wrote: 
> 
> > Don't push too hard, they may have someone design a replacement and stop buying from you.
>
> They would have to work fast! That was actually threatened during the negotiations when my costs were rising with the delays and I tried to pass on those rising costs. But there are some complexities which I've mentioned briefly here and in more detail in other threads which make that awkward for them. Still, I took the threat seriously and started to comply with some of the demands so I did not lose this order. 
> 
> The long term concerns are not an issue. You may not have read the this full thread where I state this order is the final order of this product for two reasons. The product goes into equipment that is not RoHS. The company selling the equipment is, at the end of the year, switching contract manufacturers (CM) to a company that does not handle non-RoHS work... AT ALL. Because of the early on negotiation delays our delivery was pushed out into March of 2022. They asked for a plan to mitigate this, but we had already NCNR ordered materials with long lead times, making the cost of rebuying those materials through brokers very expensive. So that was rejected and they will deal with the delays. They ARE NOT worried about the delays impacting their customers because these goods are sold through contracts that take years to negotiate. So anything in first half of 2022 is fine. The bulk of the units go into inventory to support the next several years of sales. After that the product my units go into will be redesigned, most likely incorporating my units into the rest of their product as a standard feature which can be enabled by software. 
> 
> So I'm not worried about injuring my relationship with the CM who is being replaced when the product I sell is no longer needed. My concern right now is saving every penny I can on the production of this order. 
> 
> -- 

Do you want to kill any chance of getting new design work from them?

On Tuesday, October 12, 2021 at 8:38:04 PM UTC-4, terrell....@gmail.com wrote:
> On Sunday, October 10, 2021 at 12:36:04 AM UTC-4, gnuarm.del...@gmail.com wrote: 
> > On Saturday, October 9, 2021 at 11:42:37 PM UTC-4, terrell....@gmail.com wrote: 
> > 
> > > Don't push too hard, they may have someone design a replacement and stop buying from you. 
> > 
> > They would have to work fast! That was actually threatened during the negotiations when my costs were rising with the delays and I tried to pass on those rising costs. But there are some complexities which I've mentioned briefly here and in more detail in other threads which make that awkward for them. Still, I took the threat seriously and started to comply with some of the demands so I did not lose this order. 
> > 
> > The long term concerns are not an issue. You may not have read the this full thread where I state this order is the final order of this product for two reasons. The product goes into equipment that is not RoHS. The company selling the equipment is, at the end of the year, switching contract manufacturers (CM) to a company that does not handle non-RoHS work... AT ALL. Because of the early on negotiation delays our delivery was pushed out into March of 2022. They asked for a plan to mitigate this, but we had already NCNR ordered materials with long lead times, making the cost of rebuying those materials through brokers very expensive. So that was rejected and they will deal with the delays. They ARE NOT worried about the delays impacting their customers because these goods are sold through contracts that take years to negotiate. So anything in first half of 2022 is fine. The bulk of the units go into inventory to support the next several years of sales. After that the product my units go into will be redesigned, most likely incorporating my units into the rest of their product as a standard feature which can be enabled by software. 
> > 
> > So I'm not worried about injuring my relationship with the CM who is being replaced when the product I sell is no longer needed. My concern right now is saving every penny I can on the production of this order. 
> > 
> > --
> Do you want to kill any chance of getting new design work from them?

How do you kill something that doesn't exist.  This company never asked me to design anything.  You should pay attention to the thread.  They are a middle man, a contract manufacturer.  They are also on the way out the door being replaced by another CM at the end of the year, which is why there is pressure to get things done.  Not my problem.  They gave me difficulties all along because "that's not how we operate".  Now I have the option of holding their feet to the fire and getting them to do what it says in the agreement.  

Yeah, I don't care what they think.  They want to save pennies by making me their bank.  So I'm treating them as my ATM. 

-- 

Rick C.

+-+ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
+-+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sunday, October 10, 2021 at 10:06:07 PM UTC-4, Cydrome Leader wrote:
>> Rick C <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote: 
>> > On Saturday, October 9, 2021 at 11:42:37 PM UTC-4, terrell....@gmail.com wrote: 
>> >> On Friday, October 8, 2021 at 2:25:33 PM UTC-4, gnuarm.del...@gmail.com wrote: 
>> >> > A customer who is a pain in the ass (a very large company, so they think they can toss around my small company) assured me during negotiations they would be paying the net 30 invoices in 30 days. Because of the large manufacturing costs the float on the funds is significant. 
>> >> > 
>> >> > The first of many invoices was not paid in 30 days, but closer to 45 days. On investigation I found they pay late by design. They cut payments twice a month, 15th and 30th (or 31st I assume). If the 30 days is in the first part of the month the payment is made on the 15, likewise with the second half and the last day of the month. So by design they are paying up to 2 weeks late and *never* by the due date. 
>> >> > 
>> > <<< snip >>> 
>> >> Don't push too hard, they may have someone design a replacement and stop buying from you. 
>> > 
>> > They would have to work fast! That was actually threatened during the negotiations when my costs were rising with the delays and I tried to pass on those rising costs. But there are some complexities which I've mentioned briefly here and in more detail in other threads which make that awkward for them. Still, I took the threat seriously and started to comply with some of the demands so I did not lose this order. 
>> > 
>> > The long term concerns are not an issue. You may not have read the this full thread where I state this order is the final order of this product for two reasons. The product goes into equipment that is not RoHS. The company selling the equipment is, at the end of the year, switching contract manufacturers (CM) to a company that does not handle non-RoHS work... AT ALL. Because of the early on negotiation delays our delivery was pushed out into March of 2022. They asked for a plan to mitigate this, but we had already NCNR ordered materials with long lead times, making the cost of rebuying those materials through brokers very expensive. So that was rejected and they will deal with the delays. They ARE NOT worried about the delays impacting their customers because these goods are sold through contracts that take years to negotiate. So anything in first half of 2022 is fine. The bulk of the units go into inventory to support the next several years of sales. After that the product my units go into will be redesigned, most likely incorporating my units into the rest of their product as a standard feature which can be enabled by software. 
>> > 
>> > So I'm not worried about injuring my relationship with the CM who is being replaced when the product I sell is no longer needed. My concern right now is saving every penny I can on the production of this order. 
>> >
>> Is all this drama really over just discovering that companies sometimes 
>> stretch payments past net 30? 
>> 
>> bullshit and say your shipping rates went up, move on.
> 
> Nah...  I don't charge shipping.  They provide a FedEx account number.  I'm doing this by the book!  

blame covid-19, no people work work your docks. They can pay an expedite 
fee to speed up getting those packages to fedex.

That's a shame. Covid-19 and all and your dock workers are sick. Can't 
ship products this week. It's a real bummer for your customer. Oh well, 
it's just a 15 day delay.

On Wednesday, October 13, 2021 at 12:29:56 AM UTC-4, gnuarm.del...@gmail.com wrote:
?
> How do you kill something that doesn't exist. This company never asked me to design anything. You should pay attention to the thread. They are a middle man, a contract manufacturer. They are also on the way out the door being replaced by another CM at the end of the year, which is why there is pressure to get things done. Not my problem. They gave me difficulties all along because "that's not how we operate". Now I have the option of holding their feet to the fire and getting them to do what it says in the agreement. 
> 
> Yeah, I don't care what they think. They want to save pennies by making me their bank. So I'm treating them as my ATM. 


Whatever. There's nothing like shooting your feet both off. Thee company using the boards may need some work done, and I'm sure that the CM will tell them about you.

On Friday, October 15, 2021 at 4:10:13 AM UTC-4, terrell....@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, October 13, 2021 at 12:29:56 AM UTC-4, gnuarm.del...@gmail.com wrote: 
> ? 
> > How do you kill something that doesn't exist. This company never asked me to design anything. You should pay attention to the thread. They are a middle man, a contract manufacturer. They are also on the way out the door being replaced by another CM at the end of the year, which is why there is pressure to get things done. Not my problem. They gave me difficulties all along because "that's not how we operate". Now I have the option of holding their feet to the fire and getting them to do what it says in the agreement. 
> > 
> > Yeah, I don't care what they think. They want to save pennies by making me their bank. So I'm treating them as my ATM.
> Whatever. There's nothing like shooting your feet both off. Thee company using the boards may need some work done, and I'm sure that the CM will tell them about you.

The company using the boards signed the Terms and Conditions along with the two of us.  The procurement director of my "customer" called the guy in charge of these projects at their customer (who I consider to be my real customer) and I could tell he felt very foolish as he "explained" the mechanics of the payment process and tried to tell me it was not paying late by intent, it was just the timing of my invoice and there payment schedules.  I asked him under what conditions it would pay before the 30 day dead line.  No answer.  He had zero animosity about this.  

I did receive an email saying they would pay the 2% and would pay within 30 days in the future.  So it seems the threat of invoking a lawyer didn't work out so much.  She was so pissed when we last spoke.  I kept my calm and simply pointed out that when an agreement says "30 days" it doesn't mean soon after 30 days.  They get so used to their suppliers eating whatever shit they shovel they literally think that's the way the world actually works as if they have a divine right.  

-- 

Rick C.

++- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
++- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209