jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:> On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 10:56:28 -0000 (UTC), Steve Wilson > <spamme@not.com> wrote: > >>jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:[...]>>I am now working on another approach that will give resolutions and RMS >>jitter in the tens of femtoseconds, with an insertion delay of 10 ns or >>less. The insertion delay has the same specs as the resolution and is >>locked to the same source. I plan on a LAN or USB interface to load the >>data, and a fiber optic or SMA input for the trigger. There are no ramps. > > That's impressive. Nobody sells a frequency counter with less than > about 20 ps RMS jitter. Nothing is much better than a an HP 5370.I'm talking about a delay generator. For Time Interval counters, the 5370 is very old. Technology has surpassed it. For example, the TDC-GPX2 TRA is 10ps rms single shot: https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/588/TDC-GPX2_DS000473_3-00-1379802.pdf CAD$72.11 at Mouser: https://www.mouser.ca/ProductDetail/ScioSense/TDC-GPX2-TRA? qs=gt1LBUVyoHlajl9LksNVFQ%3D%3D Digikey carries it also but the link is screwed up. -- The best designs occur in the theta state. - sw
digital capacitor
Started by ●April 15, 2021
Reply by ●April 24, 20212021-04-24
Reply by ●April 24, 20212021-04-24
Am 24.04.21 um 17:34 schrieb jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com:> On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 10:56:28 -0000 (UTC), Steve Wilson> Here's a delay generator making 100 ps steps: > > https://www.dropbox.com/s/kqmnccvy7vrwy0h/100_ps_steps.jpg?raw=1 >For a dead bug test setup I have used one of these < https://www.digikey.de/product-detail/de/microchip-technology/SY89296UTG/576-2557-ND/1617865 > or one of its brothers. Worked quite nice. Also I noted in a dual slope 1:4000 time stretcher that the final value of the charge capacitor had quite large temperature variations but the discharge went in unison, so the TC was quite small overall. That could be seen even even in Spice, how the traces re-converged over the while cycle. I used pnp current sources from Intersil / Renesas SOI transistor array. Gerhard
Reply by ●April 24, 20212021-04-24
On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 17:45:06 -0000 (UTC), Steve Wilson <spamme@not.com> wrote:>jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote: > >> On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 10:56:28 -0000 (UTC), Steve Wilson >> <spamme@not.com> wrote: >> >>>jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote: >[...] > >>>I am now working on another approach that will give resolutions and RMS >>>jitter in the tens of femtoseconds, with an insertion delay of 10 ns or >>>less. The insertion delay has the same specs as the resolution and is >>>locked to the same source. I plan on a LAN or USB interface to load the >>>data, and a fiber optic or SMA input for the trigger. There are no ramps. >> >> That's impressive. Nobody sells a frequency counter with less than >> about 20 ps RMS jitter. Nothing is much better than a an HP 5370. > >I'm talking about a delay generator. For Time Interval counters, the 5370 >is very old. Technology has surpassed it. > >For example, the TDC-GPX2 TRA is 10ps rms single shot: > >https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/588/TDC-GPX2_DS000473_3-00-1379802.pdfStrange terminology, single shot RMS.> >CAD$72.11 at Mouser: > >https://www.mouser.ca/ProductDetail/ScioSense/TDC-GPX2-TRA? >qs=gt1LBUVyoHlajl9LksNVFQ%3D%3D > >Digikey carries it also but the link is screwed up.After, what, 40 years, it's not hugely better than the 5370. Somebody used to make a 1 ps resolution counter, but they disappeared. I have one somewhere, a huge beast. SRS has an oldish counter like the 5370. It uses ramps. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc The best designs are necessarily accidental.
Reply by ●April 24, 20212021-04-24
jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:> On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 17:45:06 -0000 (UTC), Steve Wilson > <spamme@not.com> wrote: > >> jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote: >> >>> On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 10:56:28 -0000 (UTC), Steve Wilson >>> <spamme@not.com> wrote: >>> >>>> jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote: >> [...] >> >>>> I am now working on another approach that will give resolutions and RMS >>>> jitter in the tens of femtoseconds, with an insertion delay of 10 ns or >>>> less. The insertion delay has the same specs as the resolution and is >>>> locked to the same source. I plan on a LAN or USB interface to load the >>>> data, and a fiber optic or SMA input for the trigger. There are no ramps. >>> >>> That's impressive. Nobody sells a frequency counter with less than >>> about 20 ps RMS jitter. Nothing is much better than a an HP 5370. >> >> I'm talking about a delay generator. For Time Interval counters, the 5370 >> is very old. Technology has surpassed it. >> >> For example, the TDC-GPX2 TRA is 10ps rms single shot: >> >> https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/588/TDC-GPX2_DS000473_3-00-1379802.pdf > > Strange terminology, single shot RMS. > >> >> CAD$72.11 at Mouser: >> >> https://www.mouser.ca/ProductDetail/ScioSense/TDC-GPX2-TRA? >> qs=gt1LBUVyoHlajl9LksNVFQ%3D%3D >> >> Digikey carries it also but the link is screwed up. > > After, what, 40 years, it's not hugely better than the 5370. > > Somebody used to make a 1 ps resolution counter, but they disappeared. > I have one somewhere, a huge beast. > > SRS has an oldish counter like the 5370. It uses ramps. > > >I have an HP 5372A, which does some nice stuff but is such a pain to set up that it's rarely worthwhile. The whole 'modulation domain' thing is mostly a crock IME. Cheers Phil Hobbs -- Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 http://electrooptical.net http://hobbs-eo.com
Reply by ●April 24, 20212021-04-24
On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 16:22:17 -0400, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:>jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote: >> On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 17:45:06 -0000 (UTC), Steve Wilson >> <spamme@not.com> wrote: >> >>> jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote: >>> >>>> On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 10:56:28 -0000 (UTC), Steve Wilson >>>> <spamme@not.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote: >>> [...] >>> >>>>> I am now working on another approach that will give resolutions and RMS >>>>> jitter in the tens of femtoseconds, with an insertion delay of 10 ns or >>>>> less. The insertion delay has the same specs as the resolution and is >>>>> locked to the same source. I plan on a LAN or USB interface to load the >>>>> data, and a fiber optic or SMA input for the trigger. There are no ramps. >>>> >>>> That's impressive. Nobody sells a frequency counter with less than >>>> about 20 ps RMS jitter. Nothing is much better than a an HP 5370. >>> >>> I'm talking about a delay generator. For Time Interval counters, the 5370 >>> is very old. Technology has surpassed it. >>> >>> For example, the TDC-GPX2 TRA is 10ps rms single shot: >>> >>> https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/588/TDC-GPX2_DS000473_3-00-1379802.pdf >> >> Strange terminology, single shot RMS. >> >>> >>> CAD$72.11 at Mouser: >>> >>> https://www.mouser.ca/ProductDetail/ScioSense/TDC-GPX2-TRA? >>> qs=gt1LBUVyoHlajl9LksNVFQ%3D%3D >>> >>> Digikey carries it also but the link is screwed up. >> >> After, what, 40 years, it's not hugely better than the 5370. >> >> Somebody used to make a 1 ps resolution counter, but they disappeared. >> I have one somewhere, a huge beast. >> >> SRS has an oldish counter like the 5370. It uses ramps. >> >> >> > >I have an HP 5372A, which does some nice stuff but is such a pain to set >up that it's rarely worthwhile. The whole 'modulation domain' thing is >mostly a crock IME. > >Cheers > >Phil HobbsThe 5370 is a pleasure to drive from the front panel. The new HP/Keysight equivalent is horrible. The Keysight SMUs are horrible too. Just set the voltage, dammit! -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc The best designs are necessarily accidental.
Reply by ●April 24, 20212021-04-24
jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:> On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 16:22:17 -0400, Phil Hobbs > <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote: > >> jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote: >>> On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 17:45:06 -0000 (UTC), Steve Wilson >>> <spamme@not.com> wrote: >>> >>>> jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote: >>>> >>>>> On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 10:56:28 -0000 (UTC), Steve Wilson >>>>> <spamme@not.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote: >>>> [...] >>>> >>>>>> I am now working on another approach that will give resolutions and RMS >>>>>> jitter in the tens of femtoseconds, with an insertion delay of 10 ns or >>>>>> less. The insertion delay has the same specs as the resolution and is >>>>>> locked to the same source. I plan on a LAN or USB interface to load the >>>>>> data, and a fiber optic or SMA input for the trigger. There are no ramps. >>>>> >>>>> That's impressive. Nobody sells a frequency counter with less than >>>>> about 20 ps RMS jitter. Nothing is much better than a an HP 5370. >>>> >>>> I'm talking about a delay generator. For Time Interval counters, the 5370 >>>> is very old. Technology has surpassed it. >>>> >>>> For example, the TDC-GPX2 TRA is 10ps rms single shot: >>>> >>>> https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/588/TDC-GPX2_DS000473_3-00-1379802.pdf >>> >>> Strange terminology, single shot RMS. >>> >>>> >>>> CAD$72.11 at Mouser: >>>> >>>> https://www.mouser.ca/ProductDetail/ScioSense/TDC-GPX2-TRA? >>>> qs=gt1LBUVyoHlajl9LksNVFQ%3D%3D >>>> >>>> Digikey carries it also but the link is screwed up. >>> >>> After, what, 40 years, it's not hugely better than the 5370. >>> >>> Somebody used to make a 1 ps resolution counter, but they disappeared. >>> I have one somewhere, a huge beast. >>> >>> SRS has an oldish counter like the 5370. It uses ramps. >>> >>> >>> >> >> I have an HP 5372A, which does some nice stuff but is such a pain to set >> up that it's rarely worthwhile. The whole 'modulation domain' thing is >> mostly a crock IME. >> >> Cheers >> >> Phil Hobbs > > The 5370 is a pleasure to drive from the front panel. The new > HP/Keysight equivalent is horrible. > > The Keysight SMUs are horrible too. Just set the voltage, dammit!I see an HP 4145B in your future. ;) Cheers Phil Hobbs -- Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 http://electrooptical.net http://hobbs-eo.com
Reply by ●April 24, 20212021-04-24
Am 24.04.21 um 22:13 schrieb jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com:> After, what, 40 years, it's not hugely better than the 5370. > > Somebody used to make a 1 ps resolution counter, but they disappeared. > I have one somewhere, a huge beast. > > SRS has an oldish counter like the 5370. It uses ramps.Since I have the SR620, the 5370 makes a nice door stop. I have even removed its 10811A oven. Gerhard
Reply by ●April 24, 20212021-04-24
On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 1:57:05 PM UTC-7, Gerhard Hoffmann wrote:> > SRS has an oldish counter like the 5370. It uses ramps. > Since I have the SR620, the 5370 makes a nice door stop. > I have even removed its 10811A oven.Curious, what makes you prefer the SR620 to the 5370? -- john, KE5FX
Reply by ●April 24, 20212021-04-24
Am 24.04.21 um 23:56 schrieb John Miles, KE5FX:> On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 1:57:05 PM UTC-7, Gerhard Hoffmann wrote: >>> SRS has an oldish counter like the 5370. It uses ramps. >> Since I have the SR620, the 5370 makes a nice door stop. >> I have even removed its 10811A oven. > > Curious, what makes you prefer the SR620 to the 5370? > > -- john, KE5FXreliability and more consistent results. My 5370 is a packed array of maybe-contacts, I got the SR620 in calibrated state and I think it could get a new sticker without problems. -- Gerhard, Dk4XP
Reply by ●April 24, 20212021-04-24
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 00:14:20 +0200, Gerhard Hoffmann <dk4xp@arcor.de> wrote:>Am 24.04.21 um 23:56 schrieb John Miles, KE5FX: >> On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 1:57:05 PM UTC-7, Gerhard Hoffmann wrote: >>>> SRS has an oldish counter like the 5370. It uses ramps. >>> Since I have the SR620, the 5370 makes a nice door stop. >>> I have even removed its 10811A oven. >> >> Curious, what makes you prefer the SR620 to the 5370? >> >> -- john, KE5FX > >reliability and more consistent results. > >My 5370 is a packed array of maybe-contacts, >I got the SR620 in calibrated state and I think it could get >a new sticker without problems. > >-- Gerhard, Dk4XPThe 5370s are all old and dying. Pity; it was a great box. I'm astounded by how much it did with an 8-bit, 2-phase-clocked 6800 CPU. Two 8-bit registers and no MUL instruction. I think a no-op took 2 microseconds. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc The best designs are necessarily accidental.
