On 31/01/17 14:32, John Larkin wrote:> On Tue, 31 Jan 2017 14:11:55 +1100, Clifford Heath > <no.spam@please.net> wrote: > >> On 31/01/17 13:13, Jim Thompson wrote: >>> On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:50:28 -0800, John Larkin >>> <jjlarkinxyxy@highlandtechnology.com> wrote: >>> >>>> On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 18:38:37 -0700, Jim Thompson >>>> <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:33:05 -0800, John Larkin >>>>> <jjlarkinxyxy@highlandtechnology.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:37:44 -0700, Jim Thompson >>>>>> <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Nothing like a PhD telling me something can't be done to get my solver >>>>>>> genes working double-time... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Over baby-back ribs at Firebirds this afternoon I realized how to >>>>>>> parameterize my method. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> But all the information I have is from "peer-reviewed" semi-BS IEEE >>>>>>> papers. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Would someone be so kind as to take data on something common like a >>>>>>> 1N914... forward overshoot and reverse recovery at various slew rates >>>>>>> and current levels? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Then I can fit a known object. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ...Jim Thompson >>>>>> >>>>>> I posted this previously: >>>>>> >>>>>> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_a.JPG >>>>>> >>>>>> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_b.JPG >>>>>> >>>>>> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_c.JPG >>>>>> >>>>>> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_d.JPG >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> That's a 1N914 from the middle of a 50-ohm transmission line to >>>>>> ground. You can see the pulse drive level on the P400 display; that's >>>>>> the unloaded generator output voltage... divide by 2 for the 50 ohm >>>>>> load. >>>>>> >>>>>> The diode is effectively driven by 25 ohms. >>>>>> >>>>>> Generator rise time is about 1 ns. >>>>> >>>>> What is the voltage step? That's not clear to me. >>>> >>>> It's half the numbers seen on the P400 display. VH is pulse Vhigh, VL >>>> is baseline Vlow. The VH is the unloaded pulse voltage, and the >>>> generator is 50 ohms. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> genVH(50r)-------------+---------------50R scope >>>> | >>>> A 1N914 >>>> K >>>> | >>>> gnd >>> >>> Thanks! >> >> Those graphs only show the resistive dimension of the impulses. >> There will be a varying capacitance associated won't there, >> which would change the shape of the impulse depending on the >> impedance that the diode sees...? >> >> Clifford Heath. > > The P400 and the attenuator+scope are both clean 50 ohm things. The > diode is in the middle of a longish 50 ohm line, so it sees a very > ohmic 25 ohms. > > The diode itself has a C-V curve, of course. And a little inductance. > > Someone with more patience than me could do a more extensive > exploration of the 1N914 behavior.Yes. But even repeating the experiment with 2pF, or 2pF+ some R parallel, would at least give some indication of the dynamic impedance. Clifford Heath.
Spice Diode Modeling of Forward Overshoot & Reverse Recovery
Started by ●January 30, 2017
Reply by ●January 31, 20172017-01-31
Reply by ●January 31, 20172017-01-31
On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:33:05 -0800, John Larkin <jjlarkinxyxy@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:>On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:37:44 -0700, Jim Thompson ><To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: > >>Nothing like a PhD telling me something can't be done to get my solver >>genes working double-time... >> >>Over baby-back ribs at Firebirds this afternoon I realized how to >>parameterize my method. >> >>But all the information I have is from "peer-reviewed" semi-BS IEEE >>papers. >> >>Would someone be so kind as to take data on something common like a >>1N914... forward overshoot and reverse recovery at various slew rates >>and current levels? >> >>Then I can fit a known object. >> >>Thanks! >> >> ...Jim Thompson > >I posted this previously: > >https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_a.JPG > >https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_b.JPG > >https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_c.JPG > >https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_d.JPG > > >That's a 1N914 from the middle of a 50-ohm transmission line to >ground. You can see the pulse drive level on the P400 display; that's >the unloaded generator output voltage... divide by 2 for the 50 ohm >load. > >The diode is effectively driven by 25 ohms. > >Generator rise time is about 1 ns. > >In that last pic, you can see the diode holding up the falling edge of >the pulse for a couple of ns until it runs out of stored charge. > >I wouldn't expect various "1N914" parts to be super similar.John, Could you repeat the experiment at different risetimes? The theory (and gut) says the peak drops and "unsharpens" at slower risetimes and eventually goes away...the rate at which it does this is a measure of charge storage. Thanks! ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | STV, Queen Creek, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | Thinking outside the box... producing elegant solutions.
Reply by ●January 31, 20172017-01-31
On 1/30/2017 7:38 PM, Jim Thompson wrote:> On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:33:05 -0800, John Larkin > <jjlarkinxyxy@highlandtechnology.com> wrote: > >> On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:37:44 -0700, Jim Thompson >> <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: >> >>> Nothing like a PhD telling me something can't be done to get my solver >>> genes working double-time... >>> >>> Over baby-back ribs at Firebirds this afternoon I realized how to >>> parameterize my method. >>> >>> But all the information I have is from "peer-reviewed" semi-BS IEEE >>> papers. >>> >>> Would someone be so kind as to take data on something common like a >>> 1N914... forward overshoot and reverse recovery at various slew rates >>> and current levels? >>> >>> Then I can fit a known object. >>> >>> Thanks! >>> >>> ...Jim Thompson >> >> I posted this previously: >> >> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_a.JPG >> >> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_b.JPG >> >> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_c.JPG >> >> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_d.JPG >> >> >> That's a 1N914 from the middle of a 50-ohm transmission line to >> ground. You can see the pulse drive level on the P400 display; that's >> the unloaded generator output voltage... divide by 2 for the 50 ohm >> load. >> >> The diode is effectively driven by 25 ohms. >> >> Generator rise time is about 1 ns. > > What is the voltage step? That's not clear to me. > >> >> In that last pic, you can see the diode holding up the falling edge of >> the pulse for a couple of ns until it runs out of stored charge. >> >> I wouldn't expect various "1N914" parts to be super similar. > > I know :-( Been down that path many times ;-) Had to one time ban > the purchase of Motorola LM324's due to severe cross-over distortion > not seen in other vendor's parts. > > ...Jim Thompson >All of my Motorola experiences have been bad. Small signal transistors in audio stuff I was building in the '70s. A problem just waiting to happen. Arcade video games in the '80s. Mostly TTL chips. Highest failure of all brands. Often a quick fix was to replace any Motorola chips in the troubled area. Their 555 timer was notorious for that. I found some poor bonding from the die lead to the output pins on some TO-3 devices in the power supply. This was on some high end military stuff. Their RF comm stuff quality was generally fairly decent. --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Reply by ●January 31, 20172017-01-31
On Tue, 31 Jan 2017 12:00:43 -0600, gray_wolf <g_wolf@nospam.com> wrote:>On 1/30/2017 7:38 PM, Jim Thompson wrote: >> On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:33:05 -0800, John Larkin >> <jjlarkinxyxy@highlandtechnology.com> wrote: >> >>> On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:37:44 -0700, Jim Thompson >>> <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Nothing like a PhD telling me something can't be done to get my solver >>>> genes working double-time... >>>> >>>> Over baby-back ribs at Firebirds this afternoon I realized how to >>>> parameterize my method. >>>> >>>> But all the information I have is from "peer-reviewed" semi-BS IEEE >>>> papers. >>>> >>>> Would someone be so kind as to take data on something common like a >>>> 1N914... forward overshoot and reverse recovery at various slew rates >>>> and current levels? >>>> >>>> Then I can fit a known object. >>>> >>>> Thanks! >>>> >>>> ...Jim Thompson >>> >>> I posted this previously: >>> >>> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_a.JPG >>> >>> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_b.JPG >>> >>> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_c.JPG >>> >>> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_d.JPG >>> >>> >>> That's a 1N914 from the middle of a 50-ohm transmission line to >>> ground. You can see the pulse drive level on the P400 display; that's >>> the unloaded generator output voltage... divide by 2 for the 50 ohm >>> load. >>> >>> The diode is effectively driven by 25 ohms. >>> >>> Generator rise time is about 1 ns. >> >> What is the voltage step? That's not clear to me. >> >>> >>> In that last pic, you can see the diode holding up the falling edge of >>> the pulse for a couple of ns until it runs out of stored charge. >>> >>> I wouldn't expect various "1N914" parts to be super similar. >> >> I know :-( Been down that path many times ;-) Had to one time ban >> the purchase of Motorola LM324's due to severe cross-over distortion >> not seen in other vendor's parts. >> >> ...Jim Thompson >> > >All of my Motorola experiences have been bad. Small signal transistors in audio >stuff I was building in the '70s. A problem just waiting to happen. Arcade video >games in the '80s. Mostly TTL chips. Highest failure of all brands. Often a >quick fix was to replace any Motorola chips in the troubled area. Their 555 >timer was notorious for that. I found some poor bonding from the die lead to the >output pins on some TO-3 devices in the power supply. This was on some high end >military stuff. Their RF comm stuff quality was generally fairly decent. > >Their microprocessors were great. 6800, 6802, 6803, 68K. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc lunatic fringe electronics
Reply by ●February 1, 20172017-02-01
On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:33:05 -0800, John Larkin <jjlarkinxyxy@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:>On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:37:44 -0700, Jim Thompson ><To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: > >>Nothing like a PhD telling me something can't be done to get my solver >>genes working double-time... >> >>Over baby-back ribs at Firebirds this afternoon I realized how to >>parameterize my method. >> >>But all the information I have is from "peer-reviewed" semi-BS IEEE >>papers. >> >>Would someone be so kind as to take data on something common like a >>1N914... forward overshoot and reverse recovery at various slew rates >>and current levels? >> >>Then I can fit a known object. >> >>Thanks! >> >> ...Jim Thompson > >I posted this previously: > >https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_a.JPG > >https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_b.JPG > >https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_c.JPG > >https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_d.JPG > > >That's a 1N914 from the middle of a 50-ohm transmission line to >ground. You can see the pulse drive level on the P400 display; that's >the unloaded generator output voltage... divide by 2 for the 50 ohm >load. > >The diode is effectively driven by 25 ohms. > >Generator rise time is about 1 ns. > >In that last pic, you can see the diode holding up the falling edge of >the pulse for a couple of ns until it runs out of stored charge. > >I wouldn't expect various "1N914" parts to be super similar.Here is a first-pass model without a whole lot of data... <http://www.analog-innovations.com/DeviceModelsSubckts/D1N4148_FO_RRSpice_Model_2017-02-01_10-01-02.png> for various rise/fall times... ** Analysis setup ** .tran 200ns 200ns 0 10ps .STEP PARAM TRF LIST + 100ps 1ns 10ns 20ns 50ns ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | STV, Queen Creek, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | Thinking outside the box... producing elegant solutions.
Reply by ●February 1, 20172017-02-01
On Wed, 01 Feb 2017 10:06:33 -0700, Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote:>On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:33:05 -0800, John Larkin ><jjlarkinxyxy@highlandtechnology.com> wrote: > >>On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:37:44 -0700, Jim Thompson >><To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: >> >>>Nothing like a PhD telling me something can't be done to get my solver >>>genes working double-time... >>> >>>Over baby-back ribs at Firebirds this afternoon I realized how to >>>parameterize my method. >>> >>>But all the information I have is from "peer-reviewed" semi-BS IEEE >>>papers. >>> >>>Would someone be so kind as to take data on something common like a >>>1N914... forward overshoot and reverse recovery at various slew rates >>>and current levels? >>> >>>Then I can fit a known object. >>> >>>Thanks! >>> >>> ...Jim Thompson >> >>I posted this previously: >> >>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_a.JPG >> >>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_b.JPG >> >>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_c.JPG >> >>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_d.JPG >> >> >>That's a 1N914 from the middle of a 50-ohm transmission line to >>ground. You can see the pulse drive level on the P400 display; that's >>the unloaded generator output voltage... divide by 2 for the 50 ohm >>load. >> >>The diode is effectively driven by 25 ohms. >> >>Generator rise time is about 1 ns. >> >>In that last pic, you can see the diode holding up the falling edge of >>the pulse for a couple of ns until it runs out of stored charge. >> >>I wouldn't expect various "1N914" parts to be super similar. > >Here is a first-pass model without a whole lot of data... > ><http://www.analog-innovations.com/DeviceModelsSubckts/D1N4148_FO_RRSpice_Model_2017-02-01_10-01-02.png> > >for various rise/fall times... > >** Analysis setup ** >.tran 200ns 200ns 0 10ps >.STEP PARAM TRF LIST >+ 100ps 1ns 10ns 20ns 50ns > > ...Jim ThompsonThat's not a model, it's a screenshot of some waveforms. As usual. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc lunatic fringe electronics
Reply by ●February 1, 20172017-02-01
On Wed, 01 Feb 2017 09:48:54 -0800, John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:>On Wed, 01 Feb 2017 10:06:33 -0700, Jim Thompson ><To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: > >>On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:33:05 -0800, John Larkin >><jjlarkinxyxy@highlandtechnology.com> wrote: >> >>>On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:37:44 -0700, Jim Thompson >>><To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: >>> >>>>Nothing like a PhD telling me something can't be done to get my solver >>>>genes working double-time... >>>> >>>>Over baby-back ribs at Firebirds this afternoon I realized how to >>>>parameterize my method. >>>> >>>>But all the information I have is from "peer-reviewed" semi-BS IEEE >>>>papers. >>>> >>>>Would someone be so kind as to take data on something common like a >>>>1N914... forward overshoot and reverse recovery at various slew rates >>>>and current levels? >>>> >>>>Then I can fit a known object. >>>> >>>>Thanks! >>>> >>>> ...Jim Thompson >>> >>>I posted this previously: >>> >>>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_a.JPG >>> >>>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_b.JPG >>> >>>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_c.JPG >>> >>>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_d.JPG >>> >>> >>>That's a 1N914 from the middle of a 50-ohm transmission line to >>>ground. You can see the pulse drive level on the P400 display; that's >>>the unloaded generator output voltage... divide by 2 for the 50 ohm >>>load. >>> >>>The diode is effectively driven by 25 ohms. >>> >>>Generator rise time is about 1 ns. >>> >>>In that last pic, you can see the diode holding up the falling edge of >>>the pulse for a couple of ns until it runs out of stored charge. >>> >>>I wouldn't expect various "1N914" parts to be super similar. >> >>Here is a first-pass model without a whole lot of data... >> >><http://www.analog-innovations.com/DeviceModelsSubckts/D1N4148_FO_RRSpice_Model_2017-02-01_10-01-02.png> >> >>for various rise/fall times... >> >>** Analysis setup ** >>.tran 200ns 200ns 0 10ps >>.STEP PARAM TRF LIST >>+ 100ps 1ns 10ns 20ns 50ns >> >> ...Jim Thompson > > >That's not a model, it's a screenshot of some waveforms. As usual.You and Phil need to grow up and cut the crap... I'm not going to divulge what's in the model... unless you want to pay for a model >:-} I'll post an encrypted model as soon as I figure out how to get a DOS prompt in Win7 !@#$%^&* ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | STV, Queen Creek, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | Thinking outside the box... producing elegant solutions.
Reply by ●February 1, 20172017-02-01
On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:37:44 -0700, Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote:>Nothing like a PhD telling me something can't be done to get my solver >genes working double-time... > >Over baby-back ribs at Firebirds this afternoon I realized how to >parameterize my method. > >But all the information I have is from "peer-reviewed" semi-BS IEEE >papers. > >Would someone be so kind as to take data on something common like a >1N914... forward overshoot and reverse recovery at various slew rates >and current levels? > >Then I can fit a known object. > >Thanks! > > ...Jim ThompsonA first pass LTspice model: Include everything that follows (except the sig) into a file named D1N4148_FO_RR.lib... * LTspice Encrypted File * * This encrypted file has been supplied by a 3rd * party vendor that does not wish to publicize * the technology used to implement this library. * * Permission is granted to use this file for * simulations but not to reverse engineer its * contents. * *********************************************************************************** **** SPICE MODELING by JIM THOMPSON, http://www.analog-innovations.com/ � 2017 **** *********************************************************************************** ** Model is a first pass on modeling a 1N4148 diode forward overshoot ** based on limited datapoints ** Subcircuit Instantiation Node Order is: ** Anode Cathode ** Call as: Xyz Anode Cathode D1N4148_FO_RR ***** * Begin: 67 61 A0 CD CF 70 B8 00 DC E2 F0 4C 54 18 A4 F5 BD 76 D5 34 E0 E5 47 78 2F 83 17 76 7A F0 F8 4B 19 5D 35 26 6C 4F 45 88 F1 D2 4B 52 06 55 B2 D8 21 78 11 E7 34 23 43 58 C2 CC 31 0E 52 35 D3 6A A5 C6 63 FD C0 79 C6 16 DB 5E 75 72 13 B1 1E 3F 42 82 A6 39 A7 AF 3B 2A 0B 29 A5 00 CE 37 6D 26 03 61 A4 09 AD 5E 72 9C DA 02 9A C1 DC 7B F0 AE 55 B8 22 2D 70 7D 1E F0 EC E8 EA A0 18 47 C7 7B 3E 19 A8 3E 5A FD 54 28 9E 28 2A 17 4C 18 45 B5 E7 63 C1 D5 97 D3 B1 74 A5 FF 89 51 80 CB FC 12 DA 3D 85 77 61 07 9C D8 FA D4 41 54 33 6B 7B 84 70 A2 7B 1B 0B DF 76 9D A0 83 B6 62 A7 3F DA 9F 06 45 3C 4F D5 E7 AC 2E 84 3E 66 01 54 73 8A 0E 5B 9C C2 9F 11 21 65 11 9A EC 39 59 F3 6C F0 66 CF CA CA C5 58 CA 18 C9 F8 1D D0 2C 28 4F AC F1 7F 77 68 CC F6 77 BE A0 2A D3 42 29 3A A9 D8 B2 CF 9C 67 58 74 6D E3 CE AF 15 53 46 59 D5 94 B1 02 D3 6E 5C 8C C9 A2 AF 01 02 E2 46 3D AC 70 2C 8D B2 5B 81 BE 30 1B 7D 37 4F 9E 9A 48 EA 07 49 E7 E6 B8 DD 34 E0 1B B7 26 1E 6F F2 F8 FA B3 83 AA 34 60 43 3D D9 5B 22 DC 44 16 A4 E9 AA 44 21 5A F1 C0 9C BF 1C A8 22 AD CC C5 F0 29 C9 09 E0 C6 1F BE DB 78 28 82 5F 63 CA ED DB DD 54 18 05 D2 48 FE 31 D1 B6 D1 0F F7 DB 15 FF AC 16 3F A7 A1 49 7B FD DE C1 F3 88 FA 9B DC 79 4C F2 F5 19 72 40 9D BE 48 0B 48 DE 5A 67 02 D9 6A 90 6D FB D9 80 FF 9F 82 FD 71 61 D8 1E 6E FE C3 84 E8 3F 7C 8E 90 02 6C 12 DD 6F 23 7C CF 90 F3 FD D3 E4 37 4C 93 31 19 7D 5E B5 C2 2F 53 26 9C 5F D4 35 79 9A 19 6C FC 18 78 62 FC E5 BF 9B A1 39 FA 84 17 76 E0 C6 B9 B3 C1 17 C4 B4 34 12 A0 CC FE 34 49 E8 17 CF DC 14 87 06 06 9B DD D1 47 0C 99 60 7B 1F F1 08 0C 54 85 38 10 7D D0 98 3D 94 13 70 34 52 91 17 5C 15 A1 C7 78 AC AD 1D 48 CA 08 7E 95 3F 30 01 CE 54 59 B2 35 42 70 2C 23 59 FB 46 AF 98 57 07 1A 8F C5 D1 0D 59 E4 F7 9D BA 33 06 C6 B2 54 EA 12 6C FC 0E AA 9F 80 B0 B2 C1 EC 42 92 C0 93 AE 14 9F 13 80 F9 19 A2 69 55 4E 99 1A 16 AB 63 55 E5 C0 5A 61 66 F8 B3 29 B9 69 5A 1B E1 52 CA C9 9D B2 F4 39 89 15 AC BA 24 98 46 29 73 F1 34 14 B7 AB 41 97 58 EA D5 B4 49 89 6C E1 5D C6 1F 0D 9C 65 5B 54 90 3E 85 7C 16 8E A7 18 06 C6 9B 0E 64 43 A7 85 3A D4 A9 7B BE 6D BA A4 54 29 DF A0 EB 3B F4 45 4B FD E6 59 9E B7 E7 A8 DD DF 8A F8 9B B5 2A 1E 3E E7 0D FA 8E F3 AA 2A 5F 51 B4 4C 1B 91 3B 8B 31 DD A7 73 16 22 08 17 20 EC 9E BF F6 CD B6 01 58 71 9F C8 6F E2 7C EF 96 17 D5 FD 2B 31 3E DF FF 75 57 69 D3 D2 6E C4 E3 B2 CF 6C BD 18 54 D9 96 AC 10 33 B5 DC 5F 6D 37 BD D6 96 41 4A E1 A8 F7 23 D5 39 CC F0 8B 0F 82 44 27 84 A1 08 78 8D 18 79 DA D9 A7 75 97 84 28 DD 36 CA 95 6D 9B 28 2E 5B FF DF 59 C6 A1 57 EF 82 DC 30 11 94 65 EC 51 FF D5 B1 FD 29 EA C7 4B 7A 45 EA 92 37 61 D0 9B D2 E4 45 1F 73 E3 C8 3E DE FF 00 FC C1 36 8A FA 81 BB CB A9 B5 50 C3 35 8A C3 40 C0 0E 4D 75 AA 02 74 95 4C 00 0B 92 E4 09 1E 69 D2 E2 4D 3F 0D 7A 32 2B 2A CA BB 24 A2 6F B2 EB 25 1F 5A C8 BA FE 63 F2 3F BF DE F3 B7 E4 8B EE 29 94 98 DA D2 EA C2 81 BE C2 6F 03 E5 BE E7 11 80 3A D3 40 32 FD 08 0F A4 CA D6 66 BD B9 6F D2 DE 42 E5 75 C3 68 31 3C 29 53 E9 00 1C C5 E7 55 D3 DC 43 D2 F2 F6 D2 61 A7 38 7B 48 BB 97 6C 9E AF FD 2E 6A 3A 90 06 68 C8 E2 5E EB D6 65 75 37 0A AA C7 F1 46 55 13 CC 60 82 E5 46 E3 9E 72 16 2C 9E 42 F7 F1 5B 41 E0 AE 82 EA 33 34 BE 79 60 B4 A9 C8 21 9F 8D 91 87 A8 AA 3E 37 9C E8 FB 82 F6 9D 91 94 2A 00 D0 0A 37 42 09 D6 DD 78 24 9A 3B 2F 05 8B 28 AB 91 77 94 31 F2 C2 5C 27 00 17 C0 16 4E 34 79 6D 95 CC 5A E4 64 EF 11 CF 2D 2F EA 06 40 82 71 08 45 FB 95 96 E1 69 57 41 A5 78 0E 93 14 D0 82 82 D0 98 1C 27 E4 86 D9 7F A0 8C 43 B0 AF E1 16 D5 8C 56 48 65 78 02 58 C0 7C 6F D4 22 65 F2 D9 63 FB 15 7E F7 97 83 1B C6 B2 8E 88 F4 1C D9 41 9F 06 F3 E7 52 16 4D 9F A2 48 72 02 2F DD 76 41 49 15 41 BF FB 94 05 DC 4A BC E8 A3 07 56 9B 15 6A F7 63 36 D6 81 48 2F DF 8B 95 29 A1 01 64 DA 2E 24 C8 73 07 CF 1E 3D 77 2E C4 1F A9 34 3E 1C 4A AB EC 59 52 0D E7 CD BE 5A 47 AD 13 94 90 F9 39 9F B6 CA 31 D2 9D 2A 6F 24 F9 AF 1F A9 01 28 6F F9 1C 42 65 4F 11 31 32 92 38 43 0D A7 81 3F ED 8F 4B 7B C3 13 AF F7 8B 90 61 5D EF 02 0C 41 3F 0A D2 89 C8 05 B5 3D 7D AB 2B 3F 68 1E 9F 24 E5 5E E1 AF C9 89 47 7C 2A FF 7C 85 5C 66 7F 9C 2D A8 50 0E A2 85 8A A9 D5 31 78 26 E0 76 9F E6 36 78 C5 EC A1 24 EC 5D 77 83 7C 1E DA 7F 40 72 31 37 1D 9C DA 04 D7 30 DD DF 0F 97 5F AF 2F 4E 7F 22 6F E7 C5 57 E1 4B C0 59 B1 81 8D 55 C3 9E D2 20 19 70 4E C4 CB 6A 2F 5F 49 C2 68 C5 38 EC 84 1B 48 76 F4 F8 14 AA 37 45 56 E3 3D 06 A4 20 89 C9 E6 3B 6D E8 52 C2 7B 84 CE 54 F8 6A FA D3 F9 76 3C 65 F0 8D 29 40 63 E0 80 58 1D 9B FD 6E 0A 86 D8 E2 FE 7F 52 41 DA 29 9A FA E5 8A C5 45 20 67 D6 D3 55 93 4F C9 1A 70 A9 E8 94 14 F3 BC B6 CF BB D9 CA A5 68 26 23 2A BE 45 0D 48 DB 4F 38 C8 84 FA 38 75 15 18 41 1B 80 91 44 8C 0A 20 8E E4 7B 60 1C 31 D9 5C B3 D1 2B 3D DB DF 42 45 68 0B 7F B9 55 52 BC 0A CB 1E 93 E1 E2 65 F1 93 E4 17 DA 09 DA AE 94 D8 BE 20 8E 58 36 0F 3C 53 08 1B DE DD 59 87 8F D2 93 7E 50 F6 E1 20 08 BE 48 F5 B9 71 40 B6 4B FB 58 01 26 76 C4 42 25 02 2D 02 4B 01 6C 2C BD 50 E1 41 D6 49 9E DA 44 44 0F D6 E3 10 62 51 EE 9F B5 52 F9 17 45 CF 71 C5 2C 32 05 FB C8 0B F4 9E 2E 8D F8 4A 37 E5 08 B3 7F 6B C3 F2 82 75 31 0E 16 69 9A B5 D1 30 9D 07 83 03 47 5D 62 22 43 CD A6 8F 4B ED ED C3 34 6E 25 A0 F8 67 6F 2C 6C 55 2E 02 FF 31 10 7D 70 76 AB BA E3 43 70 C8 18 27 CF 7B 9B 61 B3 25 37 75 62 FC DB 29 80 FE 49 81 15 2C 16 65 E6 D1 BB F2 98 F0 5D 4A A9 32 AE 7A 6D BC 4D 8A 6D A1 62 E0 AB C8 0B D8 4D B3 22 E2 31 61 12 B7 57 97 8C C5 04 CF E5 41 DB 22 EF FB 32 79 F6 DE 6C E5 63 A6 AF 0F 5D 18 F7 1D 32 8C AE A2 C6 CA 9E 2D F1 1D DB 62 2F D2 02 86 1F D2 27 F7 52 C5 51 10 C4 B7 6F DE CD FA B3 EB 59 DE C2 09 FE B2 5B B8 71 E2 41 90 B5 F7 A2 00 6A C5 03 CD 7F EE 48 5C 6C BC 68 50 21 9B A8 DA CC B7 14 B4 18 5B 49 68 79 9D CF 68 E6 6F E1 37 B5 C8 92 18 91 0E 4F E6 F2 0F D6 AB 57 49 CD E9 16 D1 C3 CB 65 91 A6 32 72 14 53 E7 1C F7 50 7E B8 37 61 E9 83 0F C5 93 58 E2 6D 59 E8 7C 9A A5 4F 3A 09 D5 64 F0 2F 6D D4 EA 90 1B 84 CA 06 8E BF ED 07 78 3D FD 80 1F 39 CD 68 1E 07 E8 E2 83 1F B0 EA 8F 4A 48 23 26 49 91 A3 4A 2A 0F 82 B9 68 08 D1 48 04 03 A1 E4 A3 1B 28 FD 0C 11 AD A1 69 AB 63 20 34 D1 87 5E A2 34 61 CF 7F AA C8 18 10 61 F9 4D A9 E0 D9 DE 8A 2B 8F A6 1E 61 AB 28 00 3D EE 85 FC 0A 2C 7C 89 82 BC CF EF E2 3E E8 A8 6D FB 2D 75 31 0D DE ED 9F 15 C5 46 58 2C 17 F3 BB 59 6F 90 84 CB F8 01 7E C6 80 B1 AB 5E E6 5E 66 50 00 A5 AD A3 CC 98 2F E7 6E 31 17 C7 62 BD 0B 73 D6 41 0A 2E 06 5C DB 4D FC 67 F7 44 8D DA E5 0B 7A C5 45 33 11 A6 39 AC 3B 46 EB 98 F2 A8 C7 DB 9C 0D 00 5D 46 DD 1A C2 DA 9F B6 21 E0 4C 10 C9 57 53 88 87 5E CD FE 01 2E AF 84 07 20 54 FB BE 84 0C 27 96 EB 25 12 FC C8 BE 35 60 AD 56 54 DA CF 6C 8E D0 0B 37 CE 78 E7 9E CD 8F BB 9D 19 42 85 CA C0 16 80 DB 84 14 25 86 9F 8B 9B 0E 9B 47 72 18 1B F4 6B 87 84 3D 83 70 61 88 82 E5 F2 0F AF D2 2F C9 20 E8 F3 C7 2A 7F 00 AB CC 46 A8 36 6D CA B7 73 A5 FC 63 6C 4B 8C BA 2C B6 AB 21 88 93 2B A7 5C 5C 9B 7F 43 BC 0C 2F FD 57 F5 3D A2 FB AB 20 7C 02 65 85 11 66 3D E8 48 67 17 0C 39 C0 80 1E E7 60 1D EB A2 A4 09 63 6D EA 5B D1 3A 80 7C CB A3 BB 5E 78 1F F7 36 A2 E1 87 CF 6F A9 1C 03 2B B0 70 E5 9B 92 46 73 3C 93 DA 7D E5 1B 8F 46 22 A8 11 70 7F F8 74 BE F0 C8 52 20 31 19 A4 86 A8 07 4E E4 0F 2D ED D8 61 11 E6 5D * End 2231672352 423449410 ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | STV, Queen Creek, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | Thinking outside the box... producing elegant solutions.
Reply by ●February 1, 20172017-02-01
On 01/02/17 18:28, Jim Thompson wrote:> On Wed, 01 Feb 2017 09:48:54 -0800, John Larkin >> That's not a model, it's a screenshot of some waveforms. As usual. > > You and Phil need to grow up and cut the crap... I'm not going to > divulge what's in the model... unless you want to pay for a model >:-} > I'll post an encrypted model as soon as I figure out how to get a DOS > prompt in Win7 !@#$%^&*That's your prerogative of course. But the disagreement could easily be avoided by not calling it a model in the first place.
Reply by ●February 1, 20172017-02-01
On Wed, 01 Feb 2017 11:28:04 -0700, Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote:>On Wed, 01 Feb 2017 09:48:54 -0800, John Larkin ><jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote: > >>On Wed, 01 Feb 2017 10:06:33 -0700, Jim Thompson >><To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: >> >>>On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:33:05 -0800, John Larkin >>><jjlarkinxyxy@highlandtechnology.com> wrote: >>> >>>>On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 17:37:44 -0700, Jim Thompson >>>><To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>>Nothing like a PhD telling me something can't be done to get my solver >>>>>genes working double-time... >>>>> >>>>>Over baby-back ribs at Firebirds this afternoon I realized how to >>>>>parameterize my method. >>>>> >>>>>But all the information I have is from "peer-reviewed" semi-BS IEEE >>>>>papers. >>>>> >>>>>Would someone be so kind as to take data on something common like a >>>>>1N914... forward overshoot and reverse recovery at various slew rates >>>>>and current levels? >>>>> >>>>>Then I can fit a known object. >>>>> >>>>>Thanks! >>>>> >>>>> ...Jim Thompson >>>> >>>>I posted this previously: >>>> >>>>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_a.JPG >>>> >>>>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_b.JPG >>>> >>>>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_c.JPG >>>> >>>>https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53724080/Diode_TurnOn/1N914_d.JPG >>>> >>>> >>>>That's a 1N914 from the middle of a 50-ohm transmission line to >>>>ground. You can see the pulse drive level on the P400 display; that's >>>>the unloaded generator output voltage... divide by 2 for the 50 ohm >>>>load. >>>> >>>>The diode is effectively driven by 25 ohms. >>>> >>>>Generator rise time is about 1 ns. >>>> >>>>In that last pic, you can see the diode holding up the falling edge of >>>>the pulse for a couple of ns until it runs out of stored charge. >>>> >>>>I wouldn't expect various "1N914" parts to be super similar. >>> >>>Here is a first-pass model without a whole lot of data... >>> >>><http://www.analog-innovations.com/DeviceModelsSubckts/D1N4148_FO_RRSpice_Model_2017-02-01_10-01-02.png> >>> >>>for various rise/fall times... >>> >>>** Analysis setup ** >>>.tran 200ns 200ns 0 10ps >>>.STEP PARAM TRF LIST >>>+ 100ps 1ns 10ns 20ns 50ns >>> >>> ...Jim Thompson >> >> >>That's not a model, it's a screenshot of some waveforms. As usual. > >You and Phil need to grow up and cut the crap... I'm not going to >divulge what's in the model... unless you want to pay for a model >:-} >I'll post an encrypted model as soon as I figure out how to get a DOS >prompt in Win7 !@#$%^&* > > ...Jim ThompsonIf you're not going to share what you know, all you are doing is bragging about how smart you are, with no proof. Encrypted model? Sounds paranoid to me. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing precision measurement jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com
