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Very high gain transformerless boost converter - is it possible

Started by Nomadic Electron September 2, 2018
On Tuesday, September 4, 2018 at 11:28:07 AM UTC-4, 69883925...@nospam.org wrote:
> tabbypurr wrote > >On Tuesday, 4 September 2018 06:05:42 UTC+1, 69883925...@nospam.org wrote: > >> whit3rd wrote > >> >On Monday, September 3, 2018 at 1:07:08 AM UTC-7, 69883925...@nospam.org wrote: > >> > > >> >> And do not forget the 12V DC motor driving a 350V DC generator solution :-) > >> > > >> >Yes, an electric motor and a rubber band is the basis of many a > >> >van de Graaff generator, but it's easier to get 350 kV than it > >> >is to get 350W that way. That's REAL high voltage gain. > >> > >> No, high power (several kW) DC motors are common, > >> example for electric boats > >> Mains voltage generators are common in those what's it callled > >> petrol generators with 240V mains output, > >> bridge rectifier 240 * sqrt(2) = 339.411255 > >> Scrap yard, be done with it, some speed control (not the drug) > >> LOL > > > >add a carbon pile regulator > > Mechanical, centrifugal speed control, Edison already used it. > No losses. > > I had a record player that used that > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centrifugal_governor
My tractor (TO-20 ferguson) has a governor, I've had it apart but don't really understand what all the springs and levers do. George H.
On Tuesday, September 4, 2018 at 12:35:41 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
> On Mon, 3 Sep 2018 21:51:17 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> > wrote: > > >On Monday, September 3, 2018 at 1:07:08 AM UTC-7, 69883925...@nospam.org wrote: > > > >> And do not forget the 12V DC motor driving a 350V DC generator solution :-) > > > >Yes, an electric motor and a rubber band is the basis of many a > >van de Graaff generator, but it's easier to get 350 kV than it > >is to get 350W that way. That's REAL high voltage gain. > > What's the wall-plug efficiency of a Van de Graaff?
Huh, I wonder too. The few I've played with you could hear the motor load down as the thing charged up. George H.
> > > -- > > John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc trk > > jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com > http://www.highlandtechnology.com
John Larkin wrote
>On Tue, 04 Sep 2018 15:27:17 GMT, <698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org> >wrote: >>Mechanical, centrifugal speed control, Edison already used it. >>No losses. >> >>I had a record player that used that >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centrifugal_governor > >I think the record player speed regulator was frictional hence lossy.
Yes it was, 78 rpm, also friction from the needle..
On Tue, 4 Sep 2018 09:40:37 -0700, John Robertson <spam@flippers.com>
wrote:

>On 2018/09/04 9:34 AM, John Larkin wrote: >> On Tue, 4 Sep 2018 09:30:04 -0700, John Robertson <spam@flippers.com> >> wrote: >> >>> On 2018/09/03 7:55 AM, John Larkin wrote: >>>> On 3 Sep 2018 05:15:10 -0700, Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> <698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org> wrote... >>>>>> >>>>>> And do not forget the 12V DC motor driving a 350V DC generator solution :-) >>>> >>>> Dynamotor. For regulation, control the field of the generator. I think >>>> that's an amplidyne or something. They used them for things like >>>> aiming the guns on battleships. >>>> >>>>> >>>>> 100 relays switching 100 Li-ion cells from parallel to series. >>>> >>>> Overkill. Two banks of 30 relays each should do it. >>>> >>>> >>> >>> Overkill. Use 4PDT 12VDC relays and I think you are down to around 50 >>> relays...(2 batteries/relay). >>> >>> John >> >> There is my relay version of the Cockcroft&#2013266070;Walton multiplier that Phil >> calls the Groucho Marx Generator. >> >> > >I'd like to see that schematic! I work on both EM and SS equipment and >so enjoy all forms of electrical abuse... > >John :-#)#
My mistake. It was Harpo. https://www.dropbox.com/s/qycxyrty0hkkzo1/Harpo_Marx.JPG?raw=1 I wonder if there is a variant that doesn't apply so much voltage to the relay contacts. How about a rotating cam that drives a lot of switch contacts? Or a rotating insulated shaft that drives a lot of generators (stepper motors would work) wired in series. I'd like to get a bunch of doorknob capacitors, charge them each to 30KV, and then stack or drop them inside a plexiglass tube. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc trk jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com
tirsdag den 4. september 2018 kl. 19.51.31 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
> On Tue, 4 Sep 2018 09:40:37 -0700, John Robertson <spam@flippers.com> > wrote: > > >On 2018/09/04 9:34 AM, John Larkin wrote: > >> On Tue, 4 Sep 2018 09:30:04 -0700, John Robertson <spam@flippers.com> > >> wrote: > >> > >>> On 2018/09/03 7:55 AM, John Larkin wrote: > >>>> On 3 Sep 2018 05:15:10 -0700, Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> > >>>> wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> <698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org> wrote... > >>>>>> > >>>>>> And do not forget the 12V DC motor driving a 350V DC generator solution :-) > >>>> > >>>> Dynamotor. For regulation, control the field of the generator. I think > >>>> that's an amplidyne or something. They used them for things like > >>>> aiming the guns on battleships. > >>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> 100 relays switching 100 Li-ion cells from parallel to series. > >>>> > >>>> Overkill. Two banks of 30 relays each should do it. > >>>> > >>>> > >>> > >>> Overkill. Use 4PDT 12VDC relays and I think you are down to around 50 > >>> relays...(2 batteries/relay). > >>> > >>> John > >> > >> There is my relay version of the Cockcroft&#22952;alton multiplier that Phil > >> calls the Groucho Marx Generator. > >> > >> > > > >I'd like to see that schematic! I work on both EM and SS equipment and > >so enjoy all forms of electrical abuse... > > > >John :-#)# > > My mistake. It was Harpo. > > https://www.dropbox.com/s/qycxyrty0hkkzo1/Harpo_Marx.JPG?raw=1 >
that is basically: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voltage_multiplier#/media/File:Dickson_voltage_multiplier.svg
On Tuesday, September 4, 2018 at 2:10:20 PM UTC-4, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> tirsdag den 4. september 2018 kl. 19.51.31 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin: > > On Tue, 4 Sep 2018 09:40:37 -0700, John Robertson <spam@flippers.com> > > wrote: > > > > >On 2018/09/04 9:34 AM, John Larkin wrote: > > >> On Tue, 4 Sep 2018 09:30:04 -0700, John Robertson <spam@flippers.com> > > >> wrote: > > >> > > >>> On 2018/09/03 7:55 AM, John Larkin wrote: > > >>>> On 3 Sep 2018 05:15:10 -0700, Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> > > >>>> wrote: > > >>>> > > >>>>> <698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org> wrote... > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> And do not forget the 12V DC motor driving a 350V DC generator solution :-) > > >>>> > > >>>> Dynamotor. For regulation, control the field of the generator. I think > > >>>> that's an amplidyne or something. They used them for things like > > >>>> aiming the guns on battleships. > > >>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> 100 relays switching 100 Li-ion cells from parallel to series. > > >>>> > > >>>> Overkill. Two banks of 30 relays each should do it. > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>> > > >>> Overkill. Use 4PDT 12VDC relays and I think you are down to around 50 > > >>> relays...(2 batteries/relay). > > >>> > > >>> John > > >> > > >> There is my relay version of the Cockcroft&#22952;alton multiplier that Phil > > >> calls the Groucho Marx Generator. > > >> > > >> > > > > > >I'd like to see that schematic! I work on both EM and SS equipment and > > >so enjoy all forms of electrical abuse... > > > > > >John :-#)# > > > > My mistake. It was Harpo. > > > > https://www.dropbox.com/s/qycxyrty0hkkzo1/Harpo_Marx.JPG?raw=1 > > > > that is basically: > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voltage_multiplier#/media/File:Dickson_voltage_multiplier.svg
Wiki just doesn't know that with one side grounded it's called the Harpo Marx generator. (Harpo was always my favorite.) George H.
>"I think the record player speed regulator was frictional hence lossy. "
Yes but against a spring that's wound up that is exactly what is needed. Electric motor not so much...
On Tue, 4 Sep 2018 13:56:38 -0700 (PDT), jurb6006@gmail.com wrote:

>>"I think the record player speed regulator was frictional hence lossy. " > >Yes but against a spring that's wound up that is exactly what is needed. Electric motor not so much...
I could imagine a nearly lossless regulator for a wind-up Victrola, but not with 1930's technology. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc trk jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com
jurb6006@gmail.com wrote...
> > Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote: >> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voltage_multiplier#Dickson_charge_pump > > That's not what I designed.
Please give us a description. -- Thanks, - Win
On Tuesday, 4 September 2018 16:28:07 UTC+1, 69883925...@nospam.org  wrote:
> tabbypurr wrote > >On Tuesday, 4 September 2018 06:05:42 UTC+1, 69883925...@nospam.org wrote: > >> whit3rd wrote > >> >On Monday, September 3, 2018 at 1:07:08 AM UTC-7, 69883925...@nospam.org wrote: > >> > > >> >> And do not forget the 12V DC motor driving a 350V DC generator solution :-) > >> > > >> >Yes, an electric motor and a rubber band is the basis of many a > >> >van de Graaff generator, but it's easier to get 350 kV than it > >> >is to get 350W that way. That's REAL high voltage gain. > >> > >> No, high power (several kW) DC motors are common, > >> example for electric boats > >> Mains voltage generators are common in those what's it callled > >> petrol generators with 240V mains output, > >> bridge rectifier 240 * sqrt(2) = 339.411255 > >> Scrap yard, be done with it, some speed control (not the drug) > >> LOL > > > >add a carbon pile regulator > > Mechanical, centrifugal speed control, Edison already used it. > No losses. > > I had a record player that used that > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centrifugal_governor
That was used long before Edison. You say no losses. How would you implement it in a lossless way in this case? With the centrifugal control you still need something to convert mechanical position to electrical control. Perhaps there is something other than a carbon pile possible, like moving an iron core to vary reactance to control field current. NT