On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 08:08:48 -0400 Spehro Pefhany <speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> wrote in Message id: <fkif18dotv76h8jshmouuihvhqoboqpb0s@4ax.com>:>On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 05:56:44 GMT, the renowned Jan Panteltje ><pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote: > >>On a sunny day (Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:48:16 -0700) it happened Robert Baer >><robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in >><SZKdnXwyDtUP_orNnZ2dnUVZ_rGdnZ2d@posted.localnet>: >> >>>Tim Williams wrote: >>>> "Robert Baer" <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in message >>>> news:XeGdnYP1n4WMe4nNnZ2dnUVZ_jSdnZ2d@posted.localnet... >>>>> Well, ASS-u-ME-ing an additional supply, one could use a 431, a FET >>>>> and a few resistors (variant on our original Codatron(TM) design) to >>>>> produce a decent 500V reference, and then stack a bunch of FETs and >>>>> resistors to multiply by 50..too expensive. >>>> >>>> So a $2 transistor and two resistors for each subsequent 1500V is too >>>> much? And a stack of 431s (if they worked) isn't??? >>>> >>>> Then your product is impossible. >>>> >>>> Tim >>>> >>> There is NO transistor that can take 1500V reliably; and at $2 each? >>>FURRgeddit sez the FURRy Baer. >> >>I am sure I had some? >>google: >> transistor Vce 1500 >> >>Hundreds of links >> http://www.datasheetarchive.com/npn switching transistor Ic 5A-datasheet.html >> >>The ones I had (or have, seen some recently in a box) are for TV horizontal output. >>Large current, fast switching, low beta. >>Probably not suited for low current stabilizer. >>But they do exist. > >This is the highest voltage one that Digikey has in stock (I think, >anyway) > >http://ixapps.ixys.com/DataSheet/DS99978C%28IXGF30N400%29.pdfHere's one I've never seen the likes of before. Vcs (not a typo!) 2200V http://www.st.com/internet/com/TECHNICAL_RESOURCES/TECHNICAL_LITERATURE/DATASHEET/CD00197527.pdf
Zener noise / oscillations
Started by ●July 23, 2012
Reply by ●July 31, 20122012-07-31
Reply by ●July 31, 20122012-07-31
On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 08:29:09 -0400, the renowned JW <none@dev.null> wrote:>On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 08:08:48 -0400 Spehro Pefhany ><speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> wrote in Message id: ><fkif18dotv76h8jshmouuihvhqoboqpb0s@4ax.com>: > >>On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 05:56:44 GMT, the renowned Jan Panteltje >><pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >>>On a sunny day (Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:48:16 -0700) it happened Robert Baer >>><robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in >>><SZKdnXwyDtUP_orNnZ2dnUVZ_rGdnZ2d@posted.localnet>: >>> >>>>Tim Williams wrote: >>>>> "Robert Baer" <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in message >>>>> news:XeGdnYP1n4WMe4nNnZ2dnUVZ_jSdnZ2d@posted.localnet... >>>>>> Well, ASS-u-ME-ing an additional supply, one could use a 431, a FET >>>>>> and a few resistors (variant on our original Codatron(TM) design) to >>>>>> produce a decent 500V reference, and then stack a bunch of FETs and >>>>>> resistors to multiply by 50..too expensive. >>>>> >>>>> So a $2 transistor and two resistors for each subsequent 1500V is too >>>>> much? And a stack of 431s (if they worked) isn't??? >>>>> >>>>> Then your product is impossible. >>>>> >>>>> Tim >>>>> >>>> There is NO transistor that can take 1500V reliably; and at $2 each? >>>>FURRgeddit sez the FURRy Baer. >>> >>>I am sure I had some? >>>google: >>> transistor Vce 1500 >>> >>>Hundreds of links >>> http://www.datasheetarchive.com/npn switching transistor Ic 5A-datasheet.html >>> >>>The ones I had (or have, seen some recently in a box) are for TV horizontal output. >>>Large current, fast switching, low beta. >>>Probably not suited for low current stabilizer. >>>But they do exist. >> >>This is the highest voltage one that Digikey has in stock (I think, >>anyway) >> >>http://ixapps.ixys.com/DataSheet/DS99978C%28IXGF30N400%29.pdf > >Here's one I've never seen the likes of before. Vcs (not a typo!) 2200V >http://www.st.com/internet/com/TECHNICAL_RESOURCES/TECHNICAL_LITERATURE/DATASHEET/CD00197527.pdfCascodes! http://powerelectronics.com/images/pdfs/PETInnovations.pdf http://www.power-mag.com/pdf/feature_pdf/1310569380_Microgan_Feature_Layout_1.pdf Best regards, Spehro Pefhany -- "it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com
Reply by ●July 31, 20122012-07-31
Why not? I've seen 2500, even 4000V parts (like Speff's link). Not very useful (a good old EL509 has better switching, conduction and voltage performance, if lower gain), but they're out there. http://components.arrow.com/part/detail/43452324S9567125N7728 They'll have a better price in quantity, though they don't show it on this view. Digikey pricing is inflated by 2-3 times. There ought to be a 1A 1500V part out there that's even cheaper. Note that TO-220 is dubious at this voltage, but a bulkier TO-247 package will cost more. DPAK2 or DPAK3 would actually be pretty handy, since lead spacing is moderate, size is compact, and heat dissipation is via PCB. If you're encapsulating it anyway, it'll be no problem. A stack of 20 (about $80 at this price) will get you 30kV standoff, which should be enough. Note bipolar transistors aren't useful here; HOTs typically break down at only 800V (Vceo), with high leakage and secondary breakdown. MOSFETs are best at high voltage linear applications. Tim -- Deep Friar: a very philosophical monk. Website: http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms "Robert Baer" <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in message news:SZKdnXwyDtUP_orNnZ2dnUVZ_rGdnZ2d@posted.localnet...> Tim Williams wrote: >> "Robert Baer" <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in message >> news:XeGdnYP1n4WMe4nNnZ2dnUVZ_jSdnZ2d@posted.localnet... >>> Well, ASS-u-ME-ing an additional supply, one could use a 431, a FET >>> and a few resistors (variant on our original Codatron(TM) design) to >>> produce a decent 500V reference, and then stack a bunch of FETs and >>> resistors to multiply by 50..too expensive. >> >> So a $2 transistor and two resistors for each subsequent 1500V is too >> much? And a stack of 431s (if they worked) isn't??? >> >> Then your product is impossible. >> >> Tim >> > There is NO transistor that can take 1500V reliably; and at $2 each? > FURRgeddit sez the FURRy Baer. >
Reply by ●July 31, 20122012-07-31
On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 08:29:09 -0400 JW <none@dev.null> wrote in Message id: <fojf18pilb6cmcl1s7jk1k4u6kffoeq19j@4ax.com>:>On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 08:08:48 -0400 Spehro Pefhany ><speffSNIP@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> wrote in Message id: ><fkif18dotv76h8jshmouuihvhqoboqpb0s@4ax.com>: > >>On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 05:56:44 GMT, the renowned Jan Panteltje >><pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >>>On a sunny day (Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:48:16 -0700) it happened Robert Baer >>><robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in >>><SZKdnXwyDtUP_orNnZ2dnUVZ_rGdnZ2d@posted.localnet>: >>> >>>>Tim Williams wrote: >>>>> "Robert Baer" <robertbaer@localnet.com> wrote in message >>>>> news:XeGdnYP1n4WMe4nNnZ2dnUVZ_jSdnZ2d@posted.localnet... >>>>>> Well, ASS-u-ME-ing an additional supply, one could use a 431, a FET >>>>>> and a few resistors (variant on our original Codatron(TM) design) to >>>>>> produce a decent 500V reference, and then stack a bunch of FETs and >>>>>> resistors to multiply by 50..too expensive. >>>>> >>>>> So a $2 transistor and two resistors for each subsequent 1500V is too >>>>> much? And a stack of 431s (if they worked) isn't??? >>>>> >>>>> Then your product is impossible. >>>>> >>>>> Tim >>>>> >>>> There is NO transistor that can take 1500V reliably; and at $2 each? >>>>FURRgeddit sez the FURRy Baer. >>> >>>I am sure I had some? >>>google: >>> transistor Vce 1500 >>> >>>Hundreds of links >>> http://www.datasheetarchive.com/npn switching transistor Ic 5A-datasheet.html >>> >>>The ones I had (or have, seen some recently in a box) are for TV horizontal output. >>>Large current, fast switching, low beta. >>>Probably not suited for low current stabilizer. >>>But they do exist. >> >>This is the highest voltage one that Digikey has in stock (I think, >>anyway) >> >>http://ixapps.ixys.com/DataSheet/DS99978C%28IXGF30N400%29.pdf > >Here's one I've never seen the likes of before. Vcs (not a typo!) 2200V >http://www.st.com/internet/com/TECHNICAL_RESOURCES/TECHNICAL_LITERATURE/DATASHEET/CD00197527.pdfA bit more conventional: http://www.nteinc.com/specs/2500to2599/pdf/nte2593.pdf
Reply by ●July 31, 20122012-07-31
Robert Baer wrote:> > Michael A. Terrell wrote: > > > > Fred Abse wrote: > >> > >> On Sat, 28 Jul 2012 21:55:22 -0400, Michael A. Terrell wrote: > >> > >>> HV rectifire > >> > >> Freudian slip? > > * He wore THOSE??Apparently: http://www.haverford.edu/psych/ddavis/p109g/fslip.jpg
Reply by ●July 31, 20122012-07-31
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:49:36 -0700, Robert Baer wrote:> Fred Abse wrote:>> >> They're not zeners, but *avalanche* diodes. Different effect. Remember >> your posted curves of emitter and collector breakdown? >> > Oh, i remember them well; to use _that_ effect is way off datasheet > specs.IME, datasheet specs are often way off reality. -- "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled." (Richard Feynman)
Reply by ●July 31, 20122012-07-31
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:54:17 -0700, Robert Baer wrote:> Fred Abse wrote: >> a P31 phospho > Check; yellowish phosphor and orangish graticule. I invert colors to be > more readable and less ink to print; can > convert then to B&W for "publication" if need.P31 is *green*. Medium persistence. AKA "DG" in Europe. -- "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled." (Richard Feynman)
Reply by ●July 31, 20122012-07-31
On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:51:05 -0700, Robert Baer wrote:> Fred Abse wrote: >> On Sat, 28 Jul 2012 21:55:22 -0400, Michael A. Terrell wrote: >> >>> HV rectifire >> >> Freudian slip? >> >> ;-) >> > Misspelt: s/b RectumFier with preparation H.Ouch! You wanna ruin my day? Prep H doesn't work for me ;-( -- "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled." (Richard Feynman)
Reply by ●July 31, 20122012-07-31
Fred Abse a �crit :> On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:51:05 -0700, Robert Baer wrote: > >> Fred Abse wrote: >>> On Sat, 28 Jul 2012 21:55:22 -0400, Michael A. Terrell wrote: >>> >>>> HV rectifire >>> Freudian slip? >>> >>> ;-) >>> >> Misspelt: s/b RectumFier with preparation H. > > Ouch! > > You wanna ruin my day? > > Prep H doesn't work for me ;-( >Then try a bridge (super ouchhhh....) -- Thanks, Fred.
Reply by ●July 31, 20122012-07-31
On Tue, 31 Jul 2012 20:29:37 +0200, Fred Bartoli wrote:> Fred Abse a �crit : >> On Mon, 30 Jul 2012 21:51:05 -0700, Robert Baer wrote: >> >>> Fred Abse wrote: >>>> On Sat, 28 Jul 2012 21:55:22 -0400, Michael A. Terrell wrote: >>>> >>>>> HV rectifire >>>> Freudian slip? >>>> >>>> ;-) >>>> >>> Misspelt: s/b RectumFier with preparation H. >> >> Ouch! >> >> You wanna ruin my day? >> >> Prep H doesn't work for me ;-( >> >> > Then try a bridge (super ouchhhh....)Dentures in my a$$? -- "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled." (Richard Feynman)
