Disclaimer: I'm not looking for the best drone power supply. I enjoy using high quality branded products. Of course it's all made in China. That is IMO a good reason to pay close attention to branding. I intend to pay VERY close attention to my battery pack temperature, and to take the endeavor very slowly. I have a spare Dewalt 20 V Max 6 amp hour battery, and a load of new 18650 batteries from an electric monowheel/unicycle I bought mainly for the experience. I would bet the 18650s in Dewalt's 9 amp hour FLEX VOLT would work, for $200. I suppose trying to find those batteries would be impossible due to lack of labeling. I suppose one way to guess at discharge rates is to look at the application the battery is meant for, the run time of the device. But of course data is preferable. Any resource for discharge rates of 18650 batteries? Thanks.
Using cordless tool batteries to power a drone
Started by ●November 7, 2018
Reply by ●November 7, 20182018-11-07
On a sunny day (Wed, 7 Nov 2018 17:24:14 -0000 (UTC)) it happened John Doe <always.look@message.header> wrote in <prv73u$g3h$1@dont-email.me>:>Disclaimer: I'm not looking for the best drone power supply. I enjoy >using high quality branded products. Of course it's all made in China. >That is IMO a good reason to pay close attention to branding. I intend >to pay VERY close attention to my battery pack temperature, and to take >the endeavor very slowly. > >I have a spare Dewalt 20 V Max 6 amp hour battery, and a load of new >18650 batteries from an electric monowheel/unicycle I bought mainly for >the experience. > >I would bet the 18650s in Dewalt's 9 amp hour FLEX VOLT would work, for >$200. I suppose trying to find those batteries would be impossible due >to lack of labeling. > >I suppose one way to guess at discharge rates is to look at the >application the battery is meant for, the run time of the device. But of >course data is preferable. > >Any resource for discharge rates of 18650 batteries? > >Thanks.Interesting, I have been trying just that, those batteries to power my Hubsan drone. First; there are many makes of 18650 batteries, with vastly different specs. I bought 3 of the best I could find locally (expensive) was sold as 'Sony' but I am sure it is some Chinese copy, Anyways tried 2 in series and that gave me shorter flight time than 2 cell lipos. Tried 3 in series with an ebay 10A stepdown switching regulator and the thing was to heavy to fly, or the regulator limited at the >10A current required. There is a youtube video of someone doing the same thing. I still have the batteries but am back to lipos, And 2 lipos in parallel works for up to 30 minutes it seems. So look up the specs of your battery.. BTW I bought some big power resistors and use a DC ampere clamp-on meter for battery duration tests, like this: http://panteltje.com/pub/power_resistors_IMG_6291.JPG big heatsink, resistors in series or parallel, 100 W each.. http://panteltje.com/pub/big_heatsink_IMG_6292.JPG Or measure real drone current: http://panteltje.com/pub/hubsan_h501s_current_test_full_throttle_IMG_6290.JPG Posted some battery results in August 2017 to the hubsan group.
Reply by ●November 7, 20182018-11-07
<698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org> wrote in news:prvact$87v$1@gioia.aioe.org:> On a sunny day (Wed, 7 Nov 2018 17:24:14 -0000 (UTC)) it happened John > Doe <always.look@message.header> wrote in > <prv73u$g3h$1@dont-email.me>: > >>Disclaimer: I'm not looking for the best drone power supply. I enjoy >>using high quality branded products. Of course it's all made in China. >>That is IMO a good reason to pay close attention to branding. I intend >>to pay VERY close attention to my battery pack temperature, and to >>take the endeavor very slowly. >> >>I have a spare Dewalt 20 V Max 6 amp hour battery, and a load of new >>18650 batteries from an electric monowheel/unicycle I bought mainly >>for the experience. >> >>I would bet the 18650s in Dewalt's 9 amp hour FLEX VOLT would work, >>for $200. I suppose trying to find those batteries would be impossible >>due to lack of labeling. >> >>I suppose one way to guess at discharge rates is to look at the >>application the battery is meant for, the run time of the device. But >>of course data is preferable. >> >>Any resource for discharge rates of 18650 batteries? >> >>Thanks. > > Interesting, I have been trying just that, > those batteries to power my Hubsan drone. > First; there are many makes of 18650 batteries, with vastly different > specs. I bought 3 of the best I could find locally (expensive) was > sold as 'Sony' but I am sure it is some Chinese copy, > Anyways tried 2 in series and that gave me shorter flight time than 2 > cell lipos. Tried 3 in series with an ebay 10A stepdown switching > regulator and the thing was to heavy to fly, or the regulator limited > at the >10A current required. There is a youtube video of someone > doing the same thing. I still have the batteries but am back to lipos, > And 2 lipos in parallel works for up to 30 minutes it seems. > > So look up the specs of your battery.. > > BTW I bought some big power resistors and use a DC ampere clamp-on > meter for battery duration tests, like this: > http://panteltje.com/pub/power_resistors_IMG_6291.JPG > big heatsink, resistors in series or parallel, 100 W each.. > http://panteltje.com/pub/big_heatsink_IMG_6292.JPG > > Or measure real drone current: > http://panteltje.com/pub/hubsan_h501s_current_test_full_throttle_IMG_6> 290.JPG > Posted some battery results in August 2017 to the hubsan group. > > > >The 18650s are all made by maybee three major battery makers and Panasonic is the best and was the originally contracted maker. The units being dubbed any higher than 1200 mA/h are bogus. If it were true, all cars would be electric by now. And powered by little 4X original spec 18650s.
Reply by ●November 7, 20182018-11-07
On Wed, 07 Nov 2018 18:20:01 GMT, <698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org> wrote:>On a sunny day (Wed, 7 Nov 2018 17:24:14 -0000 (UTC)) it happened John Doe ><always.look@message.header> wrote in <prv73u$g3h$1@dont-email.me>: > >>Disclaimer: I'm not looking for the best drone power supply. I enjoy >>using high quality branded products. Of course it's all made in China. >>That is IMO a good reason to pay close attention to branding. I intend >>to pay VERY close attention to my battery pack temperature, and to take >>the endeavor very slowly. >> >>I have a spare Dewalt 20 V Max 6 amp hour battery, and a load of new >>18650 batteries from an electric monowheel/unicycle I bought mainly for >>the experience. >> >>I would bet the 18650s in Dewalt's 9 amp hour FLEX VOLT would work, for >>$200. I suppose trying to find those batteries would be impossible due >>to lack of labeling. >> >>I suppose one way to guess at discharge rates is to look at the >>application the battery is meant for, the run time of the device. But of >>course data is preferable. >> >>Any resource for discharge rates of 18650 batteries? >> >>Thanks. > >Interesting, I have been trying just that, >those batteries to power my Hubsan drone. >First; there are many makes of 18650 batteries, with vastly different specs. >I bought 3 of the best I could find locally (expensive) was sold as 'Sony' >but I am sure it is some Chinese copy, >Anyways tried 2 in series and that gave me shorter flight time than 2 cell lipos. >Tried 3 in series with an ebay 10A stepdown switching regulator and the thing was to heavy to fly, >or the regulator limited at the >10A current required. >There is a youtube video of someone doing the same thing. >I still have the batteries but am back to lipos, >And 2 lipos in parallel works for up to 30 minutes it seems. > >So look up the specs of your battery.. > >BTW I bought some big power resistors and use a DC ampere clamp-on meter >for battery duration tests, like this: > http://panteltje.com/pub/power_resistors_IMG_6291.JPG > big heatsink, resistors in series or parallel, 100 W each.. > http://panteltje.com/pub/big_heatsink_IMG_6292.JPG > >Or measure real drone current: > http://panteltje.com/pub/hubsan_h501s_current_test_full_throttle_IMG_6290.JPG >Posted some battery results in August 2017 to the hubsan group. > > >The 18650 batts are interesting. Some are given ridiculous ratings... 9000 mah is one. They check out at around 1000 mah. Good ones are actually 3000 mah or so, get the unprotected ones so you can draw current without it cutting out. I have a 20 volt pack I put together for a Black and Decker leaf blower. It will now blow off my whole lawn from one charge. I use a balance charger to keep it happy.
Reply by ●November 7, 20182018-11-07
On Wed, 7 Nov 2018 17:24:14 -0000 (UTC), John Doe <always.look@message.header> wrote:>Disclaimer: I'm not looking for the best drone power supply.(...)>I have a spare Dewalt 20 V Max 6 amp hour battery, and a load of new >18650 batteries from an electric monowheel/unicycle I bought mainly for >the experience.(...)>Any resource for discharge rates of 18650 batteries?Yeah: <https://lygte-info.dk/info/indexBatteriesAndChargers%20UK.html> <https://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Common18650Summary%20UK.html> <https://www.candlepowerforums.com> (search for battery tests) etc... However, you're wasting your time trying to fly with 18650 cells. There's a reason that most drones use LiPo cells. It's called specific energy and energy density: <https://greentransportation.info/energy-transportation/energy-density.html> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_density> LiPo is about 1.8MJ/kg while Lithium Ion is about 0.5MJ/kg. In other words, you need about 3 times the weight in batteries to power your drone with 18650 cells as you would with LiPo. Actually, more if you include the weight of the steel outer casing on the 18650. More later, after I'm done with todays plumbing project. -- Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
Reply by ●November 7, 20182018-11-07
The idea I'm "wasting my time" implies I have a goal in mind. As stated in my original post and quoted below... "I'm not looking for the best drone power supply." Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:> On Wed, 7 Nov 2018 17:24:14 -0000 (UTC), John Doe > <always.look@message.header> wrote: > >>Disclaimer: I'm not looking for the best drone power supply. > (...) >>I have a spare Dewalt 20 V Max 6 amp hour battery, and a load of new >>18650 batteries from an electric monowheel/unicycle I bought mainlyfor>>the experience. > (...) >>Any resource for discharge rates of 18650 batteries? > > Yeah: > <https://lygte-info.dk/info/indexBatteriesAndChargers%20UK.html> > <https://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Common18650Summary%20UK.html>> <https://www.candlepowerforums.com> (search for battery tests) > etc... > > However, you're wasting your time trying to fly with 18650 cells. > There's a reason that most drones use LiPo cells. It's called > specific energy and energy density: > <https://greentransportation.info/energy-transportation/energy-density.html>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_density> > LiPo is about 1.8MJ/kg while Lithium Ion is about 0.5MJ/kg. Inother> words, you need about 3 times the weight in batteries to power your > drone with 18650 cells as you would with LiPo. Actually, more ifyou> include the weight of the steel outer casing on the 18650. > > More later, after I'm done with todays plumbing project. >
Reply by ●November 7, 20182018-11-07
https://youtu.be/9LbDtKsdS9w Check out the first minute of that video. Drones are freaking incredible.
Reply by ●November 7, 20182018-11-07
On 2018-11-07, DLUNU <DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@DLU.org> wrote:><698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org> wrote in > news:prvact$87v$1@gioia.aioe.org: > >> On a sunny day (Wed, 7 Nov 2018 17:24:14 -0000 (UTC)) it happened John >> Doe <always.look@message.header> wrote in >> <prv73u$g3h$1@dont-email.me>: >> >>>Disclaimer: I'm not looking for the best drone power supply. I enjoy >>>using high quality branded products. Of course it's all made in China. >>>That is IMO a good reason to pay close attention to branding. I intend >>>to pay VERY close attention to my battery pack temperature, and to >>>take the endeavor very slowly. >>> >>>I have a spare Dewalt 20 V Max 6 amp hour battery, and a load of new >>>18650 batteries from an electric monowheel/unicycle I bought mainly >>>for the experience. >>> >>>I would bet the 18650s in Dewalt's 9 amp hour FLEX VOLT would work, >>>for $200. I suppose trying to find those batteries would be impossible >>>due to lack of labeling. >>> >>>I suppose one way to guess at discharge rates is to look at the >>>application the battery is meant for, the run time of the device. But >>>of course data is preferable. >>> >>>Any resource for discharge rates of 18650 batteries? >>> >>>Thanks. >> >> Interesting, I have been trying just that, >> those batteries to power my Hubsan drone. >> First; there are many makes of 18650 batteries, with vastly different >> specs. I bought 3 of the best I could find locally (expensive) was >> sold as 'Sony' but I am sure it is some Chinese copy, >> Anyways tried 2 in series and that gave me shorter flight time than 2 >> cell lipos. Tried 3 in series with an ebay 10A stepdown switching >> regulator and the thing was to heavy to fly, or the regulator limited >> at the >10A current required. There is a youtube video of someone >> doing the same thing. I still have the batteries but am back to lipos, >> And 2 lipos in parallel works for up to 30 minutes it seems. >> >> So look up the specs of your battery.. >> >> BTW I bought some big power resistors and use a DC ampere clamp-on >> meter for battery duration tests, like this: >> http://panteltje.com/pub/power_resistors_IMG_6291.JPG >> big heatsink, resistors in series or parallel, 100 W each.. >> http://panteltje.com/pub/big_heatsink_IMG_6292.JPG >> >> Or measure real drone current: >> http://panteltje.com/pub/hubsan_h501s_current_test_full_throttle_IMG_ > 6 >> 290.JPG >> Posted some battery results in August 2017 to the hubsan group. >> >> >> >> > > The 18650s are all made by maybee three major battery makers and > Panasonic is the best and was the originally contracted maker. The > units being dubbed any higher than 1200 mA/h are bogus.You gotta watch out for "fake" webasites like https://na.industrial.panasonic.com/products/batteries/rechargeable-batteries/lithium-ion/series/cylindrical-series/CS474/model/NCR18650BF> If it were true, all cars would be electric by now. And powered by > little 4X original spec 18650s.I think you under-estimate innertia. -- When I tried casting out nines I made a hash of it.
Reply by ●November 7, 20182018-11-07
On Wed, 07 Nov 2018 11:39:44 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:>On Wed, 7 Nov 2018 17:24:14 -0000 (UTC), John Doe ><always.look@message.header> wrote: > >>Disclaimer: I'm not looking for the best drone power supply. >(...) >>I have a spare Dewalt 20 V Max 6 amp hour battery, and a load of new >>18650 batteries from an electric monowheel/unicycle I bought mainly for >>the experience. >(...) >>Any resource for discharge rates of 18650 batteries? > >Yeah: ><https://lygte-info.dk/info/indexBatteriesAndChargers%20UK.html> ><https://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Common18650Summary%20UK.html> ><https://www.candlepowerforums.com> (search for battery tests) >etc... > >However, you're wasting your time trying to fly with 18650 cells. >There's a reason that most drones use LiPo cells. It's called >specific energy and energy density: ><https://greentransportation.info/energy-transportation/energy-density.html> ><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_density> >LiPo is about 1.8MJ/kg while Lithium Ion is about 0.5MJ/kg. In other >words, you need about 3 times the weight in batteries to power your >drone with 18650 cells as you would with LiPo. Actually, more if you >include the weight of the steel outer casing on the 18650. > >More later, after I'm done with todays plumbing project.Why do plumbing projects alway come up in November? Cheers
Reply by ●November 7, 20182018-11-07
On Wed, 7 Nov 2018 20:45:39 -0000 (UTC), John Doe <always.look@message.header> wrote:>The idea I'm "wasting my time" implies I have a goal in mind. As >stated in my original post and quoted below... "I'm not looking for >the best drone power supply."It's rather difficult for me to offer recommendations when all you offer is what are NOT trying to do. How to ask a question on Usenet and get a reasonable answer: 1. What problem are you trying to solve? No details or background. Just a simple one or two lines explaining what you're trying to do. 2. What do you have to work with? Level of expertise, test equipment, design abilities, experience, parts stash, and such. 3. What have you done so far, what happened, and where are you stuck? Don't worry about wasting my time. Anything is better than plumbing. Incidentally, have you look at what's inside the battery Dewalt 20v battery pack? <https://syonyk.blogspot.com/2016/09/dewalt-20v-max-30ah-battery-pack.html> Quite a bit of info there. I'm not an expert on building drones, but have had some experience dealing with their power systems. I think you'll find that weight is very important and that using heavy cylindrical cells is not going to fly very well. -- Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
