the well-dressed engineer

On 9/15/2023 2:32 PM, ehsjr wrote:

> Gotta have tees with pocket for the gym to hold the
> mp3 player.

I used to wear an iPod Shuffle clipped to my neckline while
walking:

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPod_Shuffle#/media/File:IPod_Shuffle_4G.svg>

No display -- no need!  Load with appropriate content and just
hit PLAY/PAUSE, as appropriate.

When the battery died, I switched to a Network Walkman -- but it
was a bit too bulky to hang off neckline.  But, it fit
comfortably in a closed fist:

<https://media-cldnry.s-nbcnews.com/image/upload/t_fit-1240w,f_auto,q_auto:best/msnbc/Components/Photos/050308/050308_sonymusic_hmed_6a.jpg>

Now, I put an old cell phone in a back pocket (has a display but no
need to SEE it!) and use earbuds as wired would be too long for
that stretch.

(Unfortunately, my earbuds aren't noticeable so folks often try
to chat with me as I pass)

On Friday, September 15, 2023 at 3:43:47 PM UTC-5, John Larkin wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Sep 2023 19:20:24 +0100, l...@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid 
> (Liz Tuddenham) wrote: 
> 
> >John Larkin <jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote: 
> > 
> >> https://www.insidehook.com/article/style/fall-style-trends 
> >> 
> >> I kinda miss the white shirts and skinny ties and pocket protectors. 
> >> 
> >> (I'm wearing sweats and slippers at work today, but I have an excuse.) 
> > 
> >I'm self-employed, so I can wear whatever I like - but occasionally I 
> >have to give a formal talk, so I keep a few smart skirts and tops for 
> >those occasions. 
> > 
> >About a year ago I had to give a talk on a technical topic to a more 
> >general audience. I had just bought a black and red layered 'gipsy' 
> >skirt at a car boot sale but the waistband had begun to disintegrate, so 
> >I took it all to pieces, cut off the frayed material and reconstructed a 
> >skirt which looked absolutely stunning but formal when coupled with a 
> >black silky top. I just got it finished the day before the talk. 
> > 
> >Afterwards a lady came up to me and said how much she had enjoyed the 
> >talk, even though she didn't understand a lot of it ...but she had spent 
> >most of the time admiring my skirt!
> My preferred look is "invisible."

My preferred appearance is whatever it happens to be. I dress for my own comfort... I don't have to look at me and I don't care what you think.

On 2023/09/15 8:55 a.m., legg wrote:
> On Thu, 14 Sep 2023 16:30:51 -0700, John Larkin
> <jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:
> 
>> https://www.insidehook.com/article/style/fall-style-trends
>>
>> I kinda miss the white shirts and skinny ties and pocket protectors.
>>
>> (I'm wearing sweats and slippers at work today, but I have an excuse.)
> 
> Hell, I miss shirt pockets.
> 
> Why am I the only one in my neighborhood with his shirt
> tucked in ?
> 
> RL

My wife only buys shirts that have a pocket for me - so they do exist 
(at least here in Canada) - I have a closet with twenty or so that get 
updated from time to time. I always have a pen and sharpie in the 
pocket, glasses sometimes, phone sometimes...

My wife likes shopping for clothes and I loath it, and I like fixing 
stuff around the house and she doesn't - it works for us.

John :-#)#

legg <legg@nospam.magma.ca> wrote:

[...]
> Hell, I miss shirt pockets.

I can't do without pockets somewhere in my clothes but you should try
finding skirts with decent sized pockets.  Lack of pockets is the one
big grumble women have about 'womens' clothes.  I have become adept at
opening a side seam and inserting a pocket or sewing one on the inside
of an elasticated waistband.  (You have to be careful where you put it
or it could look like a hidden colostomy bag or worse).

When friends borrow any of my skirts, their first comment is usually
"Oh!  It's got lovely big pockets!".


-- 
~ Liz Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

> On Fri, 15 Sep 2023 19:20:24 +0100, liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid
> (Liz Tuddenham) wrote:
> 
> >John Larkin <jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:
> >
> >> https://www.insidehook.com/article/style/fall-style-trends
> >> 
> >> I kinda miss the white shirts and skinny ties and pocket protectors.
> >> 
> >> (I'm wearing sweats and slippers at work today, but I have an excuse.)
> >
> >I'm self-employed, so I can wear whatever I like - but occasionally I
> >have to give a formal talk, so I keep a few smart skirts and tops for
> >those occasions.
> >
> >About a year ago I had to give a talk on a technical topic to a more
> >general audience.  I had just bought a black and red layered 'gipsy'
> >skirt at a car boot sale but the waistband had begun to disintegrate, so
> >I took it all to pieces, cut off the frayed material and reconstructed a
> >skirt which looked absolutely stunning but formal when coupled with a
> >black silky top.  I just got it finished the day before the talk.
> >
> >Afterwards a lady came up to me and said how much she had enjoyed the
> >talk, even though she didn't understand a lot of it ...but she had spent
> >most of the time admiring my skirt!
> 
> My preferred look is "invisible."

Is this from choice or because it is expected of you?


-- 
~ Liz Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

fredag den 15. september 2023 kl. 22.43.47 UTC+2 skrev John Larkin:
> On Fri, 15 Sep 2023 19:20:24 +0100, l...@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid 
> (Liz Tuddenham) wrote: 
> 
> >John Larkin <jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote: 
> > 
> >> https://www.insidehook.com/article/style/fall-style-trends 
> >> 
> >> I kinda miss the white shirts and skinny ties and pocket protectors. 
> >> 
> >> (I'm wearing sweats and slippers at work today, but I have an excuse.) 
> > 
> >I'm self-employed, so I can wear whatever I like - but occasionally I 
> >have to give a formal talk, so I keep a few smart skirts and tops for 
> >those occasions. 
> > 
> >About a year ago I had to give a talk on a technical topic to a more 
> >general audience. I had just bought a black and red layered 'gipsy' 
> >skirt at a car boot sale but the waistband had begun to disintegrate, so 
> >I took it all to pieces, cut off the frayed material and reconstructed a 
> >skirt which looked absolutely stunning but formal when coupled with a 
> >black silky top. I just got it finished the day before the talk. 
> > 
> >Afterwards a lady came up to me and said how much she had enjoyed the 
> >talk, even though she didn't understand a lot of it ...but she had spent 
> >most of the time admiring my skirt!
> My preferred look is "invisible."

that's the whole point of dress codes

On Sat, 16 Sep 2023 10:54:55 +0100, liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid
(Liz Tuddenham) wrote:

>John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 15 Sep 2023 19:20:24 +0100, liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid
>> (Liz Tuddenham) wrote:
>> 
>> >John Larkin <jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> https://www.insidehook.com/article/style/fall-style-trends
>> >> 
>> >> I kinda miss the white shirts and skinny ties and pocket protectors.
>> >> 
>> >> (I'm wearing sweats and slippers at work today, but I have an excuse.)
>> >
>> >I'm self-employed, so I can wear whatever I like - but occasionally I
>> >have to give a formal talk, so I keep a few smart skirts and tops for
>> >those occasions.
>> >
>> >About a year ago I had to give a talk on a technical topic to a more
>> >general audience.  I had just bought a black and red layered 'gipsy'
>> >skirt at a car boot sale but the waistband had begun to disintegrate, so
>> >I took it all to pieces, cut off the frayed material and reconstructed a
>> >skirt which looked absolutely stunning but formal when coupled with a
>> >black silky top.  I just got it finished the day before the talk.
>> >
>> >Afterwards a lady came up to me and said how much she had enjoyed the
>> >talk, even though she didn't understand a lot of it ...but she had spent
>> >most of the time admiring my skirt!
>> 
>> My preferred look is "invisible."
>
>Is this from choice or because it is expected of you?

Choice. I'm mildly autistic and not very social - as many engineers
are -  so don't seek or want any sort of approval or even notice from
the public. I don't want to sing, dance, act, or strut my stuff. The
New York Times Style Magazine astounds me: why would anyone want to
look like that, much less pay $12,000 to look like that?

Clothes have historically been very important. "Clothes make the man."
I don't get that at all.

I have been "performing" before potential customers and at design
reviews and such since I was a kid. My strategy is to keep low
profile, quiet and nearly invisible until I figure out the situation,
and then whack them all at once. That's fun and seems to work.

I like women to look like workers or gardeners or hikers. Tee shirt,
or better undershirt, no makeup, real looking. In a fashion magazine
with "before" and "after" makeovers, I always prefer before.

People are different. Engineering is not a social activity, because
social interaction creates consensus and suppresses dissent; original
design is fundamentally dissent. Brainstorming is great if several
social pathologies can be avoided.

Slack sucks.

John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

[...]

> I like women to look like workers or gardeners or hikers. Tee shirt,
> or better undershirt, no makeup, real looking. In a fashion magazine
> with "before" and "after" makeovers, I always prefer before.

I'm definitely not a 'heels and lipstick' person, but I much prefer
skirts to trousers, they are so comfortable.  I have an assortment of
old denim ones with oil splodges, which I wear when I'm working on
machinery.

For safety, I have to wear trousers when I am doing canal restoration
involving bonfires, but if I have to work in the wet, I wear a skirt.  A
wet skirt doesn't cling and wick water into your socks and boots like
trouser legs do - and it dries out twice as quickly because air
circulates on both sides of the material.

If I am giving a presentation, then I feel I need to stand out a bit and
wear something formal but attractive - but still no heels or makeup.

-- 
~ Liz Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

On Sat, 16 Sep 2023 16:13:45 +0100, liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid
(Liz Tuddenham) wrote:

>John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:
>
>[...]
>
>> I like women to look like workers or gardeners or hikers. Tee shirt,
>> or better undershirt, no makeup, real looking. In a fashion magazine
>> with "before" and "after" makeovers, I always prefer before.
>
>I'm definitely not a 'heels and lipstick' person, but I much prefer
>skirts to trousers, they are so comfortable.  I have an assortment of
>old denim ones with oil splodges, which I wear when I'm working on
>machinery.
>

Don't your legs get cold? That looks uncomfortable, at least in our
climate. Around here, we say "Wow, she looks great in a parka."


>For safety, I have to wear trousers when I am doing canal restoration
>involving bonfires, but if I have to work in the wet, I wear a skirt.  A
>wet skirt doesn't cling and wick water into your socks and boots like
>trouser legs do - and it dries out twice as quickly because air
>circulates on both sides of the material.
>
>If I am giving a presentation, then I feel I need to stand out a bit and
>wear something formal but attractive - but still no heels or makeup.

Mo calls heels "catchme****me" shoes.

The Hollywood/beauty queen/cheerleader look is weird. They all look
alike. Big heads, big breasts, big butts, globbed-on makeup, lipstick,
not a hint of personality. I guess some people like that look, or
people wouldn't bother to do it.

Trans females (biological men) do those things to extremes.

Bebe, our hair-stylist lady, only has glamour-type mags, so I skim
them if I forget to bring a book. I donated a bunch of car mags and
some Aviation Week mags, but they disappered rapidly.

John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:

> On Sat, 16 Sep 2023 16:13:45 +0100, liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid
> (Liz Tuddenham) wrote:
> 
> >John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:
> >
> >[...]
> >
> >> I like women to look like workers or gardeners or hikers. Tee shirt,
> >> or better undershirt, no makeup, real looking. In a fashion magazine
> >> with "before" and "after" makeovers, I always prefer before.
> >
> >I'm definitely not a 'heels and lipstick' person, but I much prefer
> >skirts to trousers, they are so comfortable.  I have an assortment of
> >old denim ones with oil splodges, which I wear when I'm working on
> >machinery.
> >
> 
> Don't your legs get cold? That looks uncomfortable, at least in our
> climate. Around here, we say "Wow, she looks great in a parka."

There are skirts and skirts.  In cold weather there is nothing nicer
than a great long floor-sweeper with a couple of warm underskirts.  You
walk around in your own bubble of warm air.  Feet and ankles may get a
little colder than in trousers, but the mid and upper legs are a lot
warmer.  Curl up on a sofa and your feet get warm too.

When working on a lathe, there are no exposed moving parts below waist
level so it is safe to wear a long skirt - which keeps the swarf out of
your socks and shoes.


[...]
> Trans females (biological men) do those things to extremes.

Those are the ones you notice, but the ones that dress and behave
sensibly don't get noticed.  There is a comparison here with teenage
girls: they can wear makeup and revealing clothes for the first time in
their lives, so they go a bit too far.  Then they find out what suits
them and settle down to be just ordinary women.

Some men have strange ideas about what it means to be a woman and think
feminity is all about glamour, sexiness or extreme effeminate behaviour.
They get mixed up with transwomen (in their own minds too) but usually
don't ever transition.


-- 
~ Liz Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk