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Solid caps can blow up?

Started by Commander Kinsey August 8, 2022
I didn't know solid caps could break. This one shorted the 12V line on a graphics card, unfortunately I have a 2.5kW supply, so the tracks got damaged somewhat, it melted the solder, and ejected itself from the board. Smelt of TCP (a disinfectant), presumably from the evaporated paint?

https://imgur.com/jYet0zF
Commander Kinsey wrote:
> I didn't know solid caps could break. This one shorted the 12V line on a > graphics card, unfortunately I have a 2.5kW supply, so the tracks got > damaged somewhat, it melted the solder, and ejected itself from the > board. Smelt of TCP (a disinfectant), presumably from the evaporated paint? > > https://imgur.com/jYet0zF
Gee, you forgot to cross-post to alt.scorekeeping.idiots and rec.games.ropeadope. Inrush can kill any electrolytic capacitor. Some are more sensitive than others. Phil Hobbs
On 8/8/22 16:54, Commander Kinsey wrote:
> I didn't know solid caps could break. This one shorted the 12V line on a > graphics card, unfortunately I have a 2.5kW supply, so the tracks got > damaged somewhat, it melted the solder, and ejected itself from the > board. Smelt of TCP (a disinfectant), presumably from the evaporated paint? > > https://imgur.com/jYet0zF
¡Ay, caramba! Make in England?
On Tue, 09 Aug 2022 02:14:44 +0100, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

> Commander Kinsey wrote: >> I didn't know solid caps could break. This one shorted the 12V line on a >> graphics card, unfortunately I have a 2.5kW supply, so the tracks got >> damaged somewhat, it melted the solder, and ejected itself from the >> board. Smelt of TCP (a disinfectant), presumably from the evaporated paint? >> >> https://imgur.com/jYet0zF > > Gee, you forgot to cross-post to alt.scorekeeping.idiots and > rec.games.ropeadope.
What?
> Inrush can kill any electrolytic capacitor. Some are more sensitive > than others.
It wasn't inrushing at the time. The card had been running without a restart for a week or two. It's been running flat out 24/7 for the last year doing astrophysics stuff on Boinc. I've never seen one of those break though, they're always the coloured wet electrolytics that burst at the end and leak brown fluid.
On 8/8/2022 7:54 PM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
> I didn't know solid caps could break. This one shorted the 12V line on a graphics card, unfortunately I have a 2.5kW supply, so the tracks got damaged somewhat, it melted the solder, and ejected itself from the board. Smelt of TCP (a disinfectant), presumably from the evaporated paint? > > https://imgur.com/jYet0zF
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymer_capacitor "Polymer electrolytic capacitors are also available in a hybrid construction. The hybrid polymer aluminium electrolytic capacitors combine a solid polymer electrolyte with a liquid electrolyte. These types are characterized by low ESR values but have low leakage currents and are insensitive to transients,[1] however they have a temperature-dependent service life similar to non-solid e-caps." It would appear, sadly, that we cannot rule out the presence of liquids in the stupid things. Paul
Commander Kinsey wrote:
> On Tue, 09 Aug 2022 02:14:44 +0100, Phil Hobbs > <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote: > >> Commander Kinsey wrote: >>> I didn't know solid caps could break. This one shorted the 12V line on a >>> graphics card, unfortunately I have a 2.5kW supply, so the tracks got >>> damaged somewhat, it melted the solder, and ejected itself from the >>> board. Smelt of TCP (a disinfectant), presumably from the evaporated >>> paint? >>> >>> https://imgur.com/jYet0zF >> >> Gee, you forgot to cross-post to alt.scorekeeping.idiots and >> rec.games.ropeadope. > > What?
alt.comp.os.windows666 etc aren't super related to a computer repair problem, I wouldn't have thought.
> >> Inrush can kill any electrolytic capacitor.&#2013266080; Some are more sensitive >> than others. > > It wasn't inrushing at the time.&#2013266080; The card had been running without a > restart for a week or two.&#2013266080; It's been running flat out 24/7 for the last > year doing astrophysics stuff on Boinc. > > I've never seen one of those break though, they're always the coloured > wet electrolytics that burst at the end and leak brown fluid.
Looks pretty wet to me. Sticking that right next to the (apparently inadequately-sized, and certainly inadequately-vented) heat sink for the SMPS switches isn't a recipe for long capacitor life. Cheers Phil Hobbs -- Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 http://electrooptical.net http://hobbs-eo.com
On Tue, 09 Aug 2022 02:57:52 +0100, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

> On 8/8/2022 7:54 PM, Commander Kinsey wrote: >> I didn't know solid caps could break. This one shorted the 12V line on a graphics card, unfortunately I have a 2.5kW supply, so the tracks got damaged somewhat, it melted the solder, and ejected itself from the board. Smelt of TCP (a disinfectant), presumably from the evaporated paint? >> >> https://imgur.com/jYet0zF > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymer_capacitor > > "Polymer electrolytic capacitors are also available in a hybrid construction. > The hybrid polymer aluminium electrolytic capacitors combine a solid polymer electrolyte > with a liquid electrolyte. These types are characterized by low ESR values but have > low leakage currents and are insensitive to transients,[1] however they have a > temperature-dependent service life similar to non-solid e-caps." > > It would appear, sadly, that we cannot rule out the presence of liquids > in the stupid things.
Can I tell from the markings which type it is?
On Tue, 09 Aug 2022 03:45:09 +0100, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

> Commander Kinsey wrote: >> On Tue, 09 Aug 2022 02:14:44 +0100, Phil Hobbs >> <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote: >> >>> Commander Kinsey wrote: >>>> I didn't know solid caps could break. This one shorted the 12V line on a >>>> graphics card, unfortunately I have a 2.5kW supply, so the tracks got >>>> damaged somewhat, it melted the solder, and ejected itself from the >>>> board. Smelt of TCP (a disinfectant), presumably from the evaporated >>>> paint? >>>> >>>> https://imgur.com/jYet0zF >>> >>> Gee, you forgot to cross-post to alt.scorekeeping.idiots and >>> rec.games.ropeadope. >> >> What? > > alt.comp.os.windows666 etc aren't super related to a computer repair > problem, I wouldn't have thought.
There are computer people in there. Why does it concern you anyway? Just hit reply.
>>> Inrush can kill any electrolytic capacitor. Some are more sensitive >>> than others. >> >> It wasn't inrushing at the time. The card had been running without a >> restart for a week or two. It's been running flat out 24/7 for the last >> year doing astrophysics stuff on Boinc. >> >> I've never seen one of those break though, they're always the coloured >> wet electrolytics that burst at the end and leak brown fluid. > > Looks pretty wet to me.
What do you mean? If you're talking about the mess to the right, that's actually a piece of copper track for the ground that's burnt off the paint above it.
> Sticking that right next to the (apparently > inadequately-sized, and certainly inadequately-vented) heat sink for the > SMPS switches isn't a recipe for long capacitor life.
Well it has to go somewhere, there's a lot of hot stuff on graphics cards. It also probably needs to be close to the other VRM stuff. Trouble is all these caps are also under the big heatsink for the main GPU which gives off up to 250W. That heatsink covers the whole card, there is nowhere cool.
On 2022/08/08 6:57 p.m., Paul wrote:
> On 8/8/2022 7:54 PM, Commander Kinsey wrote: >> I didn't know solid caps could break. This one shorted the 12V line on >> a graphics card, unfortunately I have a 2.5kW supply, so the tracks >> got damaged somewhat, it melted the solder, and ejected itself from >> the board. Smelt of TCP (a disinfectant), presumably from the >> evaporated paint? >> >> https://imgur.com/jYet0zF > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymer_capacitor > > &nbsp;&nbsp; "Polymer electrolytic capacitors are also available in a hybrid > construction. > &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The hybrid polymer aluminium electrolytic capacitors combine a > solid polymer electrolyte > &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; with a liquid electrolyte. These types are characterized by low ESR > values but have > &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; low leakage currents and are insensitive to transients,[1] however > they have a > &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; temperature-dependent service life similar to non-solid e-caps." > > It would appear, sadly, that we cannot rule out the presence of liquids > in the stupid things. > > &nbsp;&nbsp; Paul
The caps in the photo are wet electrolytic, but dry caps can also explode - Tantalum orange drop caps were notorious for that in 70s equipment. John :-#)#
On Tue, 09 Aug 2022 06:38:29 +0100, John Robertson <spam@flippers.com> wrote:

> On 2022/08/08 6:57 p.m., Paul wrote: >> On 8/8/2022 7:54 PM, Commander Kinsey wrote: >>> I didn't know solid caps could break. This one shorted the 12V line on >>> a graphics card, unfortunately I have a 2.5kW supply, so the tracks >>> got damaged somewhat, it melted the solder, and ejected itself from >>> the board. Smelt of TCP (a disinfectant), presumably from the >>> evaporated paint? >>> >>> https://imgur.com/jYet0zF >> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymer_capacitor >> >> "Polymer electrolytic capacitors are also available in a hybrid >> construction. >> The hybrid polymer aluminium electrolytic capacitors combine a >> solid polymer electrolyte >> with a liquid electrolyte. These types are characterized by low ESR >> values but have >> low leakage currents and are insensitive to transients,[1] however >> they have a >> temperature-dependent service life similar to non-solid e-caps." >> >> It would appear, sadly, that we cannot rule out the presence of liquids >> in the stupid things. > > The caps in the photo are wet electrolytic, but dry caps can also > explode - Tantalum orange drop caps were notorious for that in 70s > equipment.
I thought the ones in the photo were dry. What makes you think they're wet? I thought the wet ones were these kind with vents: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague