Forums

PC reliability

Started by legg January 13, 2020
On 2020-01-13 07:12, Whoey Louie wrote:
> On Monday, January 13, 2020 at 8:58:12 AM UTC-5, John Doe wrote: >> legg <legg@nospam.magma.ca> wrote: >> >>> Is it just an impression, or are PC's not crashing as >>> regularly as they used to? >>> >>> Looking at the machines here, it seems that this shift >>> occurred roughly around the time IDE HDDs were replaced >>> by SATA. >>> >>> With three machines, I used to expect to have a clunk HDD >>> at least once a year, if not just cloned to a larger drive. >>> >>> Haven't had a HDD fail since 2011. >>> >>> What goes? >> >> It's Windows. Crashing was radically reduced with Windows XP back in >> about 2000. Nowadays, occasional rebooting is apparently still useful, >> but the blue screen of death (BSOD) or any other system freeze almost >> never happens anymore. > > +1 > > That's how I see it, Windows has improved over time. >
-1 IMO Windows XP was last known good. Windows 7 was a step back, ok for a few years but not as good. The topper was the last update that I did this weekend. It thoroughly destroyed two Windows 7 Pro 64-bit installations. No more Microsoft here. Four PCs are on Linux now, one more to go. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/
On Monday, January 13, 2020 at 8:58:12 AM UTC-5, John Doe wrote:
> legg <legg@nospam.magma.ca> wrote: > > > Is it just an impression, or are PC's not crashing as > > regularly as they used to? > > > > Looking at the machines here, it seems that this shift > > occurred roughly around the time IDE HDDs were replaced > > by SATA. > > > > With three machines, I used to expect to have a clunk HDD > > at least once a year, if not just cloned to a larger drive. > > > > Haven't had a HDD fail since 2011. > > > > What goes? > > It's Windows. Crashing was radically reduced with Windows XP back in > about 2000. Nowadays, occasional rebooting is apparently still useful, > but the blue screen of death (BSOD) or any other system freeze almost > never happens anymore.
You say WinXP, but it was simply getting away from the Windows 95 heritage. Win2k was also very robust. It seems to me that Windows gets better with every generation. I'm not patting it on the back. I mean, I still continually threaten to install Linux all the time. But Windows is not the reboot every hour sort of system it used to be at all. My laptop crashes sometimes now, but that's more about the problems of using sleep mode which has never been perfected for sure. I guess I should use hibernate. -- Rick C. - Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging - Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
On 1/13/2020 7:20 AM, legg wrote:
> Is it just an impression, or are PC's not crashing as > regularly as they used to? > > Looking at the machines here, it seems that this shift > occurred roughly around the time IDE HDDs were replaced > by SATA. > > With three machines, I used to expect to have a clunk HDD > at least once a year, if not just cloned to a larger drive. > > Haven't had a HDD fail since 2011. > > What goes? > > RL >
I've been running my windows 7 computer since 2011. I have never reinstalled windows, I had one crash but is was during a hurricane and had problems on one outlet when we had a power surge. The computer had a minor fix $80, I had a florescent lamp die and a wall wart operated radio die, all on the same outlet. I've been trying to get my buddy that put the parts list together to do it again, I think it's time for a new computer. I saw him this morning, after some research, he says, he may just make a dual boot windows 7 and windows 10 computer. He needs 10 because Turbotax will not work on windows 7 in 2020. Mikek
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 08:20:18 -0500, legg <legg@nospam.magma.ca> wrote:

>Is it just an impression, or are PC's not crashing as >regularly as they used to?
Correct. PC's are no longer crashing in regular equally space intervals. Instead, a random number generator has been added to the crash(delay,random_seed), to produce random crashes instead. In some operating systems, these random crashes are part of the update process. The only thing regular about today's PC crashes is that they occur on the 2nd Tues of the month on Windoze machines.
>Looking at the machines here, it seems that this shift >occurred roughly around the time IDE HDDs were replaced >by SATA. > >With three machines, I used to expect to have a clunk HDD >at least once a year, if not just cloned to a larger drive. > >Haven't had a HDD fail since 2011.
SATA was introduced in about 2000. That would be 11 years of SATA while your hard disk drives were failing. I don't think it's SATA, especially since HDD density and technology has significantly improved in the last 20 years. The real question is what changed in 2011. My guess(tm) is that the power and noise levels of most PC's and HDD's has decreased to the point where PC's are no longer spinning down the drives to save power and comply with Energy Star requirements. I've had machines with old drives running 24x7 that last far longer than those that get powered on and off. There's also the situation where the replacement cycle, HDD warranty time, and operating system support life, have converged to the same span (about 5 to 7 years). That means that people are replacing machines before they need to replace the HDD.
>What goes?
The opposite of what comes. -- Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 11:58:22 -0600, amdx <nojunk@knology.net> wrote:

>He needs 10 because Turbotax will not work on windows 7 in 2020. > Mikek
Nope: "Windows 7 Support is Ending" <https://www.intuit.com/support/windows-7-end-of-life/> TurboTax for tax year 2019 and QuickBooks 2020 will install on Windows 7 (Service Pack 1 or later) PCs. So it is written, so it must be. -- Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 09:48:21 -0800, Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com>
wrote:

>IMO Windows XP was last known good. Windows 7 was a step back, ok for a >few years but not as good. The topper was the last update that I did >this weekend. It thoroughly destroyed two Windows 7 Pro 64-bit >installations.
I've done 4 free upgrades from Windoze 7 64 bit to Windoze 10. The first was a bit rough and I had to start over after restoring Win 7 from backup (Macrium Reflect Free) and actually following the directions. The problem was the virus scanner and some resident programs needed to be removed before the upgrade would work properly. the other three upgrades went smoothly, but took all day complete.
>No more Microsoft here. Four PCs are on Linux now, one more to go.
I've been planning my retirement for about a year. It may be another year before I can successfully close down the office. The plan is to run most everything on Linux and run Windoze 7 on a VM (virtual machine). Incidentally, I prefer Win 7 64 bit over the other MS offerings. XP would have been nice, but I could never get the 64 bit version to play properly. 32 bit and 4GB RAM is a severe limitation these days. I'll spare you my pontifications on Windoze 8.1 and 10. -- Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
On 2020-01-13, legg <legg@nospam.magma.ca> wrote:
> Is it just an impression, or are PC's not crashing as > regularly as they used to?
> Looking at the machines here, it seems that this shift > occurred roughly around the time IDE HDDs were replaced > by SATA.
no it happened in 1995 when I started using linux instead of DOS
> With three machines, I used to expect to have a clunk HDD > at least once a year, if not just cloned to a larger drive. > > Haven't had a HDD fail since 2011.
I've worn out up two W.D. Green 3TB drives in the media PC (one new, and one warranty replacement), switched to Purple. seems better.
> What goes?
1: real operating systems like Linux and Windows NT 2: more RAM means less swapping means drives see less wear. 3: better engineering. -- Jasen.
On 2020-01-13 11:35, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
> On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 09:48:21 -0800, Joerg <news@analogconsultants.com> > wrote: > >> IMO Windows XP was last known good. Windows 7 was a step back, ok for a >> few years but not as good. The topper was the last update that I did >> this weekend. It thoroughly destroyed two Windows 7 Pro 64-bit >> installations. > > I've done 4 free upgrades from Windoze 7 64 bit to Windoze 10. The > first was a bit rough and I had to start over after restoring Win 7 > from backup (Macrium Reflect Free) and actually following the > directions. The problem was the virus scanner and some resident > programs needed to be removed before the upgrade would work properly. > the other three upgrades went smoothly, but took all day complete. >
In my case it obviously didn't get into the heads of these <expression censored> at Microsoft that there are PCs with dual-boot configuration. They seem to have mucked with the MBR and instead of a clean rollback Windows 7 will now goes into endless trial and shutdown loops. Meaning it's trashed. How stupid.
>> No more Microsoft here. Four PCs are on Linux now, one more to go. > > I've been planning my retirement for about a year. It may be another > year before I can successfully close down the office.
I am very glad I am nearly past that point. Still supporting some clients who do not have EE's or who need tricky analog help. No large projects anymore.
> ... The plan is to > run most everything on Linux and run Windoze 7 on a VM (virtual > machine). >
That's what I plan on doing and four out of five PCs now run Linux. After trying many Linux flavors I settled on MX Linux though two are still running Lubuntu. Once the SSD, some cables and additional memory modules arrive I am going to rig up VirtualBox and then will try to activate the old Windows 7 licenses from each PC in the VM. The native Windows 7 is now nuked anyhow and then I can use that space for data. The only devices that might might be recalcitrant inside a VM are the Signalhound analyzer and generator. However, I just received an email from Signalhound support that some of their customers have succesfully run their new software (Spike) inside a VM. I believe one has to make sure that OpenGL 2 or better is enabled via guest additions but they said that except for occasional hangups due to the extra USB latency it should otherwise work.
> Incidentally, I prefer Win 7 64 bit over the other MS offerings. XP > would have been nice, but I could never get the 64 bit version to play > properly. 32 bit and 4GB RAM is a severe limitation these days. I'll > spare you my pontifications on Windoze 8.1 and 10. >
I won't touch Windows 10, not even with a 10ft pole, especially after the lastest episode. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/
Jasen Betts <jasen@xnet.co.nz> wrote in news:qvij3l$va3$1
@gonzo.revmaps.no-ip.org:

> On 2020-01-13, legg <legg@nospam.magma.ca> wrote: >> Is it just an impression, or are PC's not crashing as >> regularly as they used to? > >> Looking at the machines here, it seems that this shift >> occurred roughly around the time IDE HDDs were replaced >> by SATA. > > no it happened in 1995 when I started using linux instead of DOS > >> With three machines, I used to expect to have a clunk HDD >> at least once a year, if not just cloned to a larger drive. >> >> Haven't had a HDD fail since 2011. > > I've worn out up two W.D. Green 3TB drives in the media PC (one
new,
> and one warranty replacement), switched to Purple. seems better. > >> What goes? > > 1: real operating systems like Linux and Windows NT > 2: more RAM means less swapping means drives see less wear. > 3: better engineering. > >
Yes. Think about logic too. The number of false highs and false lows on a 5 volt TTL circuit have to be higher than the number on a 3.3 volt or other, lower voltage logic switching levels. Feature size reduction is a 'big' thing... errr... small thing. Makes everything smaller, including errors.
On Monday, January 13, 2020 at 5:15:46 AM UTC-8, legg wrote:
> Is it just an impression, or are PC's not crashing as > regularly as they used to?
...
> With three machines, I used to expect to have a clunk HDD > at least once a year, if not just cloned to a larger drive. > > Haven't had a HDD fail since 2011.
At a guess, the shakeout in HD manufacturers has removed some of the time-to-market pressure on new motor/head/platter designs, and modeling has improved enough to keep 'em spinning and sensing. i've opened some failed HD units, and mostly the nonworking ones had power supply shorts. An occasional enthusiastic engineer puts 13V zeners everywhere and either the one in the power supply OR the one on the disk drive fails short. The tolerance on motor power is HUGE, it'd be better to just accept a minor spike, but no, we gotta spend money on a fuse and/or transzorb. It's a bit tiresome hunting down suppliers for surface mount repair parts, but it keeps my cost/terabyte below two-digit dollars.