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LiIon Battery Question

Started by Jim Thompson December 7, 2016
LiIon Battery Question...

Is there a voltage below which the battery is considered toast, or is
a battery that is totally discharged rechargeable?
		
                                        ...Jim Thompson
-- 
| James E.Thompson                                 |    mens     |
| Analog Innovations                               |     et      |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems  |    manus    |
| STV, Queen Creek, AZ 85142    Skype: skypeanalog |             |
| Voice:(480)460-2350  Fax: Available upon request |  Brass Rat  |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com |    1962     |
Den onsdag den 7. december 2016 kl. 18.55.42 UTC+1 skrev Jim Thompson:
> LiIon Battery Question... > > Is there a voltage below which the battery is considered toast, or is > a battery that is totally discharged rechargeable? >
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/low_voltage_cut_off
On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 10:07:55 -0800 (PST), Lasse Langwadt Christensen
<langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote:

>Den onsdag den 7. december 2016 kl. 18.55.42 UTC+1 skrev Jim Thompson: >> LiIon Battery Question... >> >> Is there a voltage below which the battery is considered toast, or is >> a battery that is totally discharged rechargeable? >> > >http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/low_voltage_cut_off
Thanks, Lasse! _Precisely_ the info I was seeking! (I'm writing a Spice model for Microchip MCP73831/2 and the datasheet is just a wee-bit vague ;-) ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | STV, Queen Creek, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |
On Wed, 07 Dec 2016 11:18:32 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote:

> On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 10:07:55 -0800 (PST), Lasse Langwadt Christensen > <langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote: > >>Den onsdag den 7. december 2016 kl. 18.55.42 UTC+1 skrev Jim Thompson: >>> LiIon Battery Question... >>> >>> Is there a voltage below which the battery is considered toast, or is >>> a battery that is totally discharged rechargeable? >>> >>> >>http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/low_voltage_cut_off > > Thanks, Lasse! _Precisely_ the info I was seeking! > > (I'm writing a Spice model for Microchip MCP73831/2 and the datasheet is > just a wee-bit vague ;-) > > ...Jim Thompson
Let it discharge too low and on charge it may burst into flame. Charge it too high and it may burst into flame. Not always -- but enough that anyone who flies electric RC has an acquaintance who has, or has nearly, burnt their shop down. -- Tim Wescott Wescott Design Services http://www.wescottdesign.com I'm looking for work -- see my website!
On Wednesday, December 7, 2016 at 1:33:19 PM UTC-5, Tim Wescott wrote:
> On Wed, 07 Dec 2016 11:18:32 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: > > > On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 10:07:55 -0800 (PST), Lasse Langwadt Christensen > > <langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote: > > > >>Den onsdag den 7. december 2016 kl. 18.55.42 UTC+1 skrev Jim Thompson: > >>> LiIon Battery Question... > >>> > >>> Is there a voltage below which the battery is considered toast, or is > >>> a battery that is totally discharged rechargeable? > >>> > >>> > >>http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/low_voltage_cut_off > > > > Thanks, Lasse! _Precisely_ the info I was seeking! > > > > (I'm writing a Spice model for Microchip MCP73831/2 and the datasheet is > > just a wee-bit vague ;-) > > > > ...Jim Thompson > > Let it discharge too low and on charge it may burst into flame. > > Charge it too high and it may burst into flame. > > Not always -- but enough that anyone who flies electric RC has an > acquaintance who has, or has nearly, burnt their shop down.
I'm getting a more burly Lipo charger for my son. Should we set up some kind of flame proof table to charge on? George H.
> > -- > > Tim Wescott > Wescott Design Services > http://www.wescottdesign.com > > I'm looking for work -- see my website!
On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 11:25:27 -0800 (PST), George Herold
<gherold@teachspin.com> wrote:

>On Wednesday, December 7, 2016 at 1:33:19 PM UTC-5, Tim Wescott wrote: >> On Wed, 07 Dec 2016 11:18:32 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote:
[snip]
>> >> Let it discharge too low and on charge it may burst into flame. >> >> Charge it too high and it may burst into flame. >> >> Not always -- but enough that anyone who flies electric RC has an >> acquaintance who has, or has nearly, burnt their shop down. >I'm getting a more burly Lipo charger for my son. >Should we set up some kind of flame proof table to charge on? > >George H. >>
After the recent Samsung episode I leave no LiIon battery charging unattended. But a flame-proof table/surround might be a good idea. ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | STV, Queen Creek, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | "If you don't read [a] newspaper, you're uninformed. If you do read it, you're misinformed" -Denzel Washington
Den onsdag den 7. december 2016 kl. 20.25.31 UTC+1 skrev George Herold:
> On Wednesday, December 7, 2016 at 1:33:19 PM UTC-5, Tim Wescott wrote: > > On Wed, 07 Dec 2016 11:18:32 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: > > > > > On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 10:07:55 -0800 (PST), Lasse Langwadt Christensen > > > <langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote: > > > > > >>Den onsdag den 7. december 2016 kl. 18.55.42 UTC+1 skrev Jim Thompson: > > >>> LiIon Battery Question... > > >>> > > >>> Is there a voltage below which the battery is considered toast, or is > > >>> a battery that is totally discharged rechargeable? > > >>> > > >>> > > >>http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/low_voltage_cut_off > > > > > > Thanks, Lasse! _Precisely_ the info I was seeking! > > > > > > (I'm writing a Spice model for Microchip MCP73831/2 and the datasheet is > > > just a wee-bit vague ;-) > > > > > > ...Jim Thompson > > > > Let it discharge too low and on charge it may burst into flame. > > > > Charge it too high and it may burst into flame. > > > > Not always -- but enough that anyone who flies electric RC has an > > acquaintance who has, or has nearly, burnt their shop down. > I'm getting a more burly Lipo charger for my son. > Should we set up some kind of flame proof table to charge on? >
you can get a fancy pouch for charging https://hobbyking.com/en_us/lithium-polymer-charge-pack-25x33cm-jumbo-sack.html I've seen some put batteries in an old cooking pot while charging
On Wed, 07 Dec 2016 12:23:10 -0800, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:

> Den onsdag den 7. december 2016 kl. 20.25.31 UTC+1 skrev George Herold: >> On Wednesday, December 7, 2016 at 1:33:19 PM UTC-5, Tim Wescott wrote: >> > On Wed, 07 Dec 2016 11:18:32 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: >> > >> > > On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 10:07:55 -0800 (PST), Lasse Langwadt Christensen >> > > <langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote: >> > > >> > >>Den onsdag den 7. december 2016 kl. 18.55.42 UTC+1 skrev Jim >> > >>Thompson: >> > >>> LiIon Battery Question... >> > >>> >> > >>> Is there a voltage below which the battery is considered toast, >> > >>> or is a battery that is totally discharged rechargeable? >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/low_voltage_cut_off >> > > >> > > Thanks, Lasse! _Precisely_ the info I was seeking! >> > > >> > > (I'm writing a Spice model for Microchip MCP73831/2 and the >> > > datasheet is just a wee-bit vague ;-) >> > > >> > > ...Jim Thompson >> > >> > Let it discharge too low and on charge it may burst into flame. >> > >> > Charge it too high and it may burst into flame. >> > >> > Not always -- but enough that anyone who flies electric RC has an >> > acquaintance who has, or has nearly, burnt their shop down. >> I'm getting a more burly Lipo charger for my son. >> Should we set up some kind of flame proof table to charge on? >> >> > you can get a fancy pouch for charging > https://hobbyking.com/en_us/lithium-polymer-charge-pack-25x33cm-jumbo-
sack.html
> > I've seen some put batteries in an old cooking pot while charging
Pouch, cooking pot, metal ammo can, corral of bricks, charge on the patio (if you live in temperate climes), etc. I charge them in an ammo can (and haven't had one go poof -- but one of my RC club members had one catch fire in his basement, and it burnt through a piece of scrap carpet before he could get it out the door). A friend of mine who flies in competition and who is REALLY detail oriented says that just charging them warm and letting them cool is a Bad Thing, because the capacity drops with temperature, turning a fully charged battery into an overcharged battery. If you didn't get him a balancing charger, get him a balancer. -- Tim Wescott Wescott Design Services http://www.wescottdesign.com I'm looking for work -- see my website!
On Wednesday, December 7, 2016 at 3:54:23 PM UTC-5, Tim Wescott wrote:
> On Wed, 07 Dec 2016 12:23:10 -0800, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote: > > > Den onsdag den 7. december 2016 kl. 20.25.31 UTC+1 skrev George Herold: > >> On Wednesday, December 7, 2016 at 1:33:19 PM UTC-5, Tim Wescott wrote: > >> > On Wed, 07 Dec 2016 11:18:32 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: > >> > > >> > > On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 10:07:55 -0800 (PST), Lasse Langwadt Christensen > >> > > <langwadt@fonz.dk> wrote: > >> > > > >> > >>Den onsdag den 7. december 2016 kl. 18.55.42 UTC+1 skrev Jim > >> > >>Thompson: > >> > >>> LiIon Battery Question... > >> > >>> > >> > >>> Is there a voltage below which the battery is considered toast, > >> > >>> or is a battery that is totally discharged rechargeable? > >> > >>> > >> > >>> > >> > >>http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/low_voltage_cut_off > >> > > > >> > > Thanks, Lasse! _Precisely_ the info I was seeking! > >> > > > >> > > (I'm writing a Spice model for Microchip MCP73831/2 and the > >> > > datasheet is just a wee-bit vague ;-) > >> > > > >> > > ...Jim Thompson > >> > > >> > Let it discharge too low and on charge it may burst into flame. > >> > > >> > Charge it too high and it may burst into flame. > >> > > >> > Not always -- but enough that anyone who flies electric RC has an > >> > acquaintance who has, or has nearly, burnt their shop down. > >> I'm getting a more burly Lipo charger for my son. > >> Should we set up some kind of flame proof table to charge on? > >> > >> > > you can get a fancy pouch for charging > > https://hobbyking.com/en_us/lithium-polymer-charge-pack-25x33cm-jumbo- > sack.html > > > > I've seen some put batteries in an old cooking pot while charging > > Pouch, cooking pot, metal ammo can, corral of bricks, charge on the patio > (if you live in temperate climes), etc. I charge them in an ammo can > (and haven't had one go poof -- but one of my RC club members had one > catch fire in his basement, and it burnt through a piece of scrap carpet > before he could get it out the door).
Ahh I've got these big metal tins I've been wondering what to do with. Now I know. George H.
> > A friend of mine who flies in competition and who is REALLY detail > oriented says that just charging them warm and letting them cool is a Bad > Thing, because the capacity drops with temperature, turning a fully > charged battery into an overcharged battery. > > If you didn't get him a balancing charger, get him a balancer.
Hmm I don't know.. he picked out this one. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000QVK1B6/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER
> > -- > > Tim Wescott > Wescott Design Services > http://www.wescottdesign.com > > I'm looking for work -- see my website!
"Jim Thompson" <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote in 
message news:mtog4cl1nfb2ng2eam707l4olnf4nvhp28@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 11:25:27 -0800 (PST), George Herold > <gherold@teachspin.com> wrote: > >>On Wednesday, December 7, 2016 at 1:33:19 PM UTC-5, Tim Wescott wrote: >>> On Wed, 07 Dec 2016 11:18:32 -0700, Jim Thompson wrote: > > [snip] >>> >>> Let it discharge too low and on charge it may burst into flame. >>> >>> Charge it too high and it may burst into flame. >>> >>> Not always -- but enough that anyone who flies electric RC has an >>> acquaintance who has, or has nearly, burnt their shop down. >>I'm getting a more burly Lipo charger for my son. >>Should we set up some kind of flame proof table to charge on? >> >>George H. >>> > > After the recent Samsung episode I leave no LiIon battery charging > unattended. But a flame-proof table/surround might be a good idea. > > ...Jim Thompson > -- > | James E.Thompson | mens | > | Analog Innovations | et | > | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | > | STV, Queen Creek, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | | > | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | > | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | > > "If you don't read [a] newspaper, you're uninformed. > If you do read it, you're misinformed" > -Denzel Washington
A flame proof charging container for Li battery powered devices might make a good product.