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Fanless or near fanless PC 2014 ? (sub 5 watts)

Started by Skybuck Flying September 6, 2014
Hello,

This processor has caught my eye, it's a sub 5 watt processor from intel, it 
has latest features and even a graphics chip inside of it ?!

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-broadwell-core-m,27596.html

This reminds me of the 80486 chip which also didn't have a heatsink or a 
fan.

I checked my pentium 166, it still came with a heatsink and a fan.

I very much like the idea of a chip without a fan. A heatsink could still be 
possible though.

So perhaps a slightly hotter chip is still possible for a PC design.

I wonder: does this core m chip come with a passive heatsink for laptop, and 
what about pc/desktop ?

There was mention of a docking system with fan to increase performance ? How 
so ? Can the chip run faster ? Does it use thermal throttling ?

Anyway, using such a chip for a fanless or nearly fanless PC would also 
require other components without a fan.

My main worry would be the motherboard which could also have a tiny little 
shitty noisy fan which would ruin the design.

Other points of worry are harddisks, though these don't seem to generate 
that much heat.

And ram chips... not sure what there tdp would be.

The 80486 PC did come with a fan in the power supply... not sure why that 
fan was there... probably too cool the power supply itself but possibly also 
for some airflow through case otherwise temperature may rise... which seems 
somewhat logical.

So perhaps truely fanless system not possible, except maybe with conducting 
the heat away via heatsinks outside of case.

I am very much interested in a fanless PC desktop design, but it has to be 
somewhat powerfull at running applications/games.

So I have some questions about this core m chip:

1. How does it compare to an AMD X2 3800+ dual core chip from 2006 ? ;) 
(manufactured in 2001?!)

Is core M slower, equal or faster than this AMD chip ?

2. Is core M capable of running company of heroes 2 at some decent graphics 
settings and frame rate ? that would be nice ! ;) (at least company of 
heroes 1 can be considered best game of all time, not yet sure if coh2 is 
any good ;) but I sure wanna try it)

3. core M should also be capable of running warcraft frozen throne, another 
great game with many many many mods, which make it a lot of fun.

4. Video playback should be smooth.

5. Internet browsing should be smooth as well.

I am hoping yes is the answer to all these 5 questions, if 2 is no, that's 
kinda ok.

I want to know:

1. What motherboards are available for core m which can also be used for 
desktop designs ? These motherboard must not have any fan on them.

2. Additional components are also nice to know... ram chips and such.

3. Also power supply capable of dissipating this heat away/out of case 
without requiring a fan would be very cool... I think heatsinks didn't exist 
during the time of the 80486 so this could be a chance to create a really 
cool, noiseless PC, except maybe for the harddisk slightly rattling but 
that's ok I think ;).

My main wish is too just have a PC which does not require any cleaning... as 
to not break things because of cleaning... also safes time.

Also I want this PC to be capable of running software to it's maximum 
potential/maximum cpu/gpu strain without overheating the system or causing 
other thermal issues.

Think of highly intensive cpu processing, perhaps bitcoin, or evolutionary 
software, or folding, rendering, gaming, any kind of high cpu/gpu/intensive 
computing.

This desktop PC design should also be able to function at ambient 
temperatures of 35 degrees celcius perhaps even 40 degrees celcius now with 
rising global temperatures ;) So this PC should be capable of running 
through a summer's heat at a breeze/without breaking a sweat ;).

What disappoints me about the chip is:

Only 2 cores, though it can run 4 threads.

Very small cpu cores, compared to the gpu core.... not sure if having 
cpu+gpu on one chip offers some kind of performance adventage.
At the same time it's kinda nice though, only 4.5 watts for cpu+gpu !

However a different chip could also be considered in combination with a 
seperated gpu chip.

Assuming both chips can run at 4.5 watts max, and still be cooled by a 
passive cooling system.

I would then probably prefer a 4, 8-core or 16 core cpu with large L1 
caches. (L1 cache size is usuable kept secret apperently, kinda annoying) 
very important cache.

GPU should then also run at 4.5 watts. I'm afraid such a gpu simply does not 
exist... so this is kinda surprising from intel. Seems like intel turning 
into a graphics company more than a cpu company ;)

Though AMD did same with ATI purchase... weird isn't it :)

I have yet to come across a competing product from AMD which can compete 
with core M... perhaps AMD does not want to compete for this segment ? Or 
perhaps it does and I am unaware of it at this moment... so please do share 
product suggestions.

2016 is still far away... as some of you may know I was hoping for an arm 
based system in 2016... but to wait another 2 years is kinda painfull... 
even 1 year is kinda painfull.

Also intel has some very nice instruction set extensions which seem 
promising. I am not sure how many clock cycles those new instructions 
take... like aes, or bmi, or crc32, some data on that would also be nice. (I 
think broadwell also has the mulx instruction for multi-byte arithmetic 
enhancements, well done intel ! pretty amazing ! ;))

(Skylake with the sha/bitcoin instruction would also be very fun to have, 
but probably too far away for now ;))

Another reason for my interest in a new PC is my current PC is sucking up a 
lllllllooottttt of dust and making a lllloottt of noise... and I am kinda 
sick of it... and web browsing has become somewhat slow/sluggish.... also 
youtube sluggish and so forth. Some more speed from a new system would be 
nice... it could speed up my day a bit... and save some time as well...

I am scared to run intense software on my current system (google skybuck's 
dream pc from 2006 to get an idea what it is).

I am scared it will suck something up and/or cause an overheat, or damage to 
ram chips because of stuff sucked in.

Only thing that worries me with a fanless design is harddisk damage cause of 
overheat... anybody have any experience with running hitachi deskstar or 
ultrastar harddisk in fanless systems ? Does it work ? Or does it crash the 
harddisk ? (Harddisk have some ram chips nowadays as well, probably causing 
some heat). I think it needs some airflow to keep cool, not sure though.

So basically I kinda want the same technology that's inside laptop's or 
tablet but with more room to breath, but coupled to my BIG-ASS monitor and 
BIG-ASS keyboard and a bit more ooppmmh if possible.

(I'd like the system to have overheat protection just in case, so system 
must completely shutdown in the case of overheat whatever it's doing. My 
current system/motherboard (winfast) has that and it's kinda nice ;))

Bye,
  Skybuck. 

I need to clarify something though.

The scare about running software 24/7 also has to do with the internet, 
software, windows, acrobat, flash, and all kinds of updating going on.

Nowadays system gets bothered with nags about software updates, especially 
windows itself can shutdown the system without ever asking.

Other software might perhaps do it on startup... but not sure.

So Microsoft itself has kinda made me scared of running software 24/7 
because of their updates.

Scarey idea to be running a heavy-duty evolver and suddenly this update-crap 
starts which can fail/rollback and have all kinds of annoying consequences.

Could also jeapordize final results or influence calculations etc.

Though this updating behaviour can be termined/disabled but then system is 
at risk of hacking attempt which is even more scarier lol.

So all I am saying is leaving it unattended... hmmmm bad idea nowadays.

May have to think about a seperated system/computer disconnected from 
internet, to run task nonstop ;)

But if system must be connected to internet to run the task and update stuff 
to the net then you can start to see the problem a bit ;)

Bye,
  Skybuck. 

On Saturday, September 6, 2014 3:39:46 AM UTC, Skybuck Flying wrote:

> > This processor has caught my eye, it's a sub 5 watt processor from intel, it > > has latest features and even a graphics chip inside of it ?! > > > > http://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-broadwell-core-m,27596.html > > Bye, > > Skybuck.
You might also look at the AMD Kabini. 25 watts power . Not fanless as sold but you could go fanless with a simple water cooling heat sink. Dan
On Sat, 6 Sep 2014 05:14:47 -0700 (PDT), "dcaster@krl.org"
<dcaster@krl.org> Gave us:

snip

  4 watts.  HD capable

http://www.solid-run.com/product/cubox-i4pro/
Holy fokking shit batman:

Not a core m... but something in the neighbourhood:

As hudson would say:

"Stop your grinnin' and drop your linen!"

And as usf4 guile would say: "here we go" lol:

http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=msi_x99_fail&num=1

Perhaps overheat protection is not taking it to far... how about a fire 
extinquisher ;)

Bye,
  Skyhell :)



> > <dcaster@krl.org> Gave us: > snip > 4 watts. HD capable > > http://www.solid-run.com/product/cubox-i4pro/
Not saying for better or for worst. But when we say PC, it usually imply x86.
Skybuck Flying wrote:

> I need to clarify something though. > > The scare about running software 24/7 also has to do with the internet, > software, windows, acrobat, flash, and all kinds of updating going on. >
I've had a Linux web server with email, ssh, ftp, etc. services as well the web server, running at home for more than a decade. Long ago, I got hacked a couple of times, now I think I have the security set high enough so that the idiots and even the pros are prelly well locked out. These are run on Dell Optiplex desktop machines. My last personal desktop was bought used, and ran non-stop for 12 years before i decided to upgrade. The Optiplex is their commercial grade machine, not the home grade. As for fanless, there are Intel Atom processors that can run fanless, and you can get fanless power supplies for them. A fanless Atom motherboard with SSD is pretty robust. We have made a number of these for remote device controllers. Jon
On 9/5/2014 11:57 PM, Skybuck Flying wrote:
> I need to clarify something though. > > The scare about running software 24/7 also has to do with the internet, > software, windows, acrobat, flash, and all kinds of updating going on. > > Nowadays system gets bothered with nags about software updates, > especially windows itself can shutdown the system without ever asking.
Worse it can start up a PC on its own. I have an XP desktop that can start itself from the OFF state. I don't know if this is from the network card or what. But usually when it does turn itself on when I turn it off it does a Windows update.
> Other software might perhaps do it on startup... but not sure. > > So Microsoft itself has kinda made me scared of running software 24/7 > because of their updates.
You can turn off the automatic updating.
> Scarey idea to be running a heavy-duty evolver and suddenly this > update-crap starts which can fail/rollback and have all kinds of > annoying consequences. > > Could also jeapordize final results or influence calculations etc. > > Though this updating behaviour can be termined/disabled but then system > is at risk of hacking attempt which is even more scarier lol.
It was at risk before the update was available, so what changes? When do you want to do the updates?
> So all I am saying is leaving it unattended... hmmmm bad idea nowadays. > > May have to think about a seperated system/computer disconnected from > internet, to run task nonstop ;) > > But if system must be connected to internet to run the task and update > stuff to the net then you can start to see the problem a bit ;)
Yeah, get used to it. -- Rick
Den s=F8ndag den 7. september 2014 23.11.28 UTC+2 skrev rickman:
> On 9/5/2014 11:57 PM, Skybuck Flying wrote: >=20 > > I need to clarify something though. >=20 > > >=20 > > The scare about running software 24/7 also has to do with the internet, >=20 > > software, windows, acrobat, flash, and all kinds of updating going on. >=20 > > >=20 > > Nowadays system gets bothered with nags about software updates, >=20 > > especially windows itself can shutdown the system without ever asking. >=20 >=20 >=20 > Worse it can start up a PC on its own. I have an XP desktop that can=20 >=20 > start itself from the OFF state. I don't know if this is from the=20 >=20 > network card or what. But usually when it does turn itself on when I=20 >=20 > turn it off it does a Windows update. >=20
I don't know if it is only when hibernating, but pretty much every=20 Wednesday at 2:00 am -Lasse
Yeah you right on the spot with the auto turn-on.

I have also seen some freaky shit with that.

For example if I just gently touch the backplate of the PC near the network 
card it will actually turn the PC on from sleep mode ?!

How weird is that ?!

Also sometimes I wake up and the PC is running... either because it's sleep 
mode didn't fully complete and started upgrades and let the PC run all 
night.

Or something else happened like mini earth quake, or truck driving by or 
neighbour bumping around and I think this moves the USB mouse and then 
switches on the PC ?! Woopsie totally weird.

Ofcourse some of this behaviour could be turned of in the BIOS possibily... 
but still weird that it's so sensitive ?! wow...

Yup... maybe vacuum cleaner turning it on.. or touching usb ports... other 
possibilities probably exists too.

Bye,
  Skybuck.