12V Circuit breakers for auto battery chargers

handyman@home.com wrote:
> 
> Michael A. Terrell wrote:
> >
> >   I've seen them used in place of fuses for the headlights on cars,
> >School buses & RVs.  Is there an RV dealer near you?
> 
> Ok, I know they are used in vehicles, but I didn't know what for.  Now
> that you told me, I'll have to chack around for RV dealers.
> 
> >   As far as the idiot you talked to, battery chargers aren't rocket
> >science, and the repair people in that field aren't all that smart.
> 
> You got that right....  A battery charger is one of the most simple
> electric devices I can think of repairing, (except for getting the parts
> for some of them).  It's just a basic power supply with an amp meter.
> 
> That idiot is not smart, he just thinks he is, and does his best to make
> everyone look like they know nothing.  Almost everyone in town hates the
> guy, and they all go to another motor rebuilder in another town about 25
> miles away.  That includes the auto parts store right across the street.
> If the parts store cant get the part, they recommend the repair guy 25
> miles away, rather than this idiot who's shop is right across the
> street.  Even my lawyer has a few choice words to say when he went there
> about that starter issue.
> 
> The charger does work just fine, except for that breaker.  I wired a
> regular 30A plug fuse across the breaker, and charged up my car battery
> before.  At least I can use it till I get the part. I only had it charge
> on the 15A setting, so I knew the fuse would hold up, but still be there
> in case of a dead short.  Most dead shorts are caused because the clips
> touch each other when we're hooking them up.  It never fails!  I always
> wondered why they dont put some covering on the clips so only the teeth
> are bare.  That would not be rocket science either!


http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/search/Circuit+Breaker/N0227/C0335.oap
shows 79 in their inventory.  See if any of the local dealers have a
website.


   Here are photos of a lot of styles of automotive breakers.  They are
also used on boats.

<https://www.google.com/search?q=Automotive+circuit+breakers&num=100&hl=en&safe=off&client=firefox-a&hs=LFI&tbo=d&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=oK7uUM-8J8Wy0AHJ4YGoBQ&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAA&biw=1280&bih=872>

   It looks like 35A isn't a common value.



   I used to rebuild some vacuum cleaner motors, and sell them back to
the guy who gave them to me as scrap.  He was convinced that I had an
armature lathe to clean up the commutators.  I used a large ink eraser
to polish the contacts & a modified Exacto knife blade to undercut the
mica. Drop in a new set of brushes, and maybe a new bearing and they
were ready for another 10 years of reliable service.

On Wednesday, January 9, 2013 10:54:40 PM UTC-5, Martin Riddle wrote:

>=20
> Sounds like a custom auto breaker. Most Automotive breakers are 15, 20=20
>=20
> or 30A.
>=20
> I'd order it thru Schumacher.  There might be a reason it's 35A and it=20
>=20
> may have a special thermal curve.
>=20

There's nothing special about it, it's a new class of SAE-J553 thermal brea=
ker for wiring protection, tons of manufacturers make them for OEM as well =
as aftermarket sales. There are Types I, II, and III depending on how it re=
sets, manual reset would be a Type III. Looking at the Bussman curves of tr=
ip time versus % overcurrent, there is very little difference between a 30A=
 and a 35A, both fall in the same uncertainty interval of trip time for an =
approximate 300% overload at 100A of approximately 7.5 seconds. Selecting a=
 40A would definitely be risky as the trip time nearly doubles. The charger=
 is not intended to provide continuous 100A charging current, it is just a =
QuickStart sales gimmick feature, nothing original, 15A is its max continuo=
us charge current setting.=20
The OP is the same eternal-september and now AIOE troll who poses as all so=
rts of different people, as if anyone cares.=20

On Thu, 10 Jan 2013 07:16:20 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
<mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:

>
>handyman@home.com wrote:
>> 
>> Michael A. Terrell wrote:
>> >
>> >   I've seen them used in place of fuses for the headlights on cars,
>> >School buses & RVs.  Is there an RV dealer near you?
>> 
>> Ok, I know they are used in vehicles, but I didn't know what for.  Now
>> that you told me, I'll have to chack around for RV dealers.
>> 
>> >   As far as the idiot you talked to, battery chargers aren't rocket
>> >science, and the repair people in that field aren't all that smart.
>> 
>> You got that right....  A battery charger is one of the most simple
>> electric devices I can think of repairing, (except for getting the parts
>> for some of them).  It's just a basic power supply with an amp meter.
>> 
>> That idiot is not smart, he just thinks he is, and does his best to make
>> everyone look like they know nothing.  Almost everyone in town hates the
>> guy, and they all go to another motor rebuilder in another town about 25
>> miles away.  That includes the auto parts store right across the street.
>> If the parts store cant get the part, they recommend the repair guy 25
>> miles away, rather than this idiot who's shop is right across the
>> street.  Even my lawyer has a few choice words to say when he went there
>> about that starter issue.
>> 
>> The charger does work just fine, except for that breaker.  I wired a
>> regular 30A plug fuse across the breaker, and charged up my car battery
>> before.  At least I can use it till I get the part. I only had it charge
>> on the 15A setting, so I knew the fuse would hold up, but still be there
>> in case of a dead short.  Most dead shorts are caused because the clips
>> touch each other when we're hooking them up.  It never fails!  I always
>> wondered why they dont put some covering on the clips so only the teeth
>> are bare.  That would not be rocket science either!
>
>
>http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/search/Circuit+Breaker/N0227/C0335.oap
>shows 79 in their inventory.  See if any of the local dealers have a
>website.
>
>
>   Here are photos of a lot of styles of automotive breakers.  They are
>also used on boats.
>
><https://www.google.com/search?q=Automotive+circuit+breakers&num=100&hl=en&safe=o
ff&client=firefox-a&hs=LFI&tbo=d&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&source=lnms&tbm=i
sch&sa=X&ei=oK7uUM-8J8Wy0AHJ4YGoBQ&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAA&biw=1280&bih=872>
>
>   It looks like 35A isn't a common value.
>
>
>
>   I used to rebuild some vacuum cleaner motors, and sell them back to
>the guy who gave them to me as scrap.  He was convinced that I had an
>armature lathe to clean up the commutators.  I used a large ink eraser
>to polish the contacts & a modified Exacto knife blade to undercut the
>mica. Drop in a new set of brushes, and maybe a new bearing and they
>were ready for another 10 years of reliable service.

Although the local auto parts stores said they did not have them, I went
to NAPA and asked to see the auto fuses.  They had them right there on
the rack, but not 35A.  They had 30A and 40A.  I decided to better
protect the charger, I'd go with the 30A.  It's installed, the charger
works fine on the 2A and 15A settings.  I have not yet tried it on the
100A setting because there are no really discharged batteries at the
moment.  

Using your link, 
It looks like this one:
http://www.optifuse.com/Images/acb-h.jpg

35A does appear to be an oddball size.

The one thing I found a little puzzling was the silver and copper
colored studs.  I didn't know there was a polarity to these, but I
connected it the same way (colors) as the original one.  

I still cant understand how they rate this one at 100A when it only had
a 35A breaker, I can only assume it's like they rate audio amps.  Rather
than RMS, it's peak.  So the charger can put out 100A for a brief amount
of time when the car is being started.  (just a guess).

Now I'll have to dig out the other 2 or 3 dead battery chargers I got
laying around, and see if I can fix them.  I know for fact that one of
them needed a breaker, but I could not identify the size and the charger
is some generic no name brand.  I think it's a 10A charger, so I'd guess
a 10A breaker would work.  Since it's winter, now is a good time to fix
items like this.  In warm weather I'm too busy with big projects.

That's a great idea how to clean up those motor commutators.  I've
rebuilt some motors myself, usually used emory cloth.  Motors are not
that complicated, it's just having the right equipment, particularly of
the coils need to be rewound.  That local idiot got all the equipment
when another business shut down because the owner retired or died....
That was before I lived here, but I always hear how nice the original
owner was, and what an asshole this new guy is.

handyman@home.com wrote:
> 
> On Thu, 10 Jan 2013 07:16:20 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
> ?mike.terrell@earthlink.net? wrote:
> 
> ?
> ?handyman@home.com wrote:
> ??
> ?? Michael A. Terrell wrote:
> ?? ?
> ?? ?   I've seen them used in place of fuses for the headlights on cars,
> ?? ?School buses ? RVs.  Is there an RV dealer near you?
> ??
> ?? Ok, I know they are used in vehicles, but I didn't know what for.  Now
> ?? that you told me, I'll have to chack around for RV dealers.
> ??
> ?? ?   As far as the idiot you talked to, battery chargers aren't rocket
> ?? ?science, and the repair people in that field aren't all that smart.
> ??
> ?? You got that right....  A battery charger is one of the most simple
> ?? electric devices I can think of repairing, (except for getting the parts
> ?? for some of them).  It's just a basic power supply with an amp meter.
> ??
> ?? That idiot is not smart, he just thinks he is, and does his best to make
> ?? everyone look like they know nothing.  Almost everyone in town hates the
> ?? guy, and they all go to another motor rebuilder in another town about 25
> ?? miles away.  That includes the auto parts store right across the street.
> ?? If the parts store cant get the part, they recommend the repair guy 25
> ?? miles away, rather than this idiot who's shop is right across the
> ?? street.  Even my lawyer has a few choice words to say when he went there
> ?? about that starter issue.
> ??
> ?? The charger does work just fine, except for that breaker.  I wired a
> ?? regular 30A plug fuse across the breaker, and charged up my car battery
> ?? before.  At least I can use it till I get the part. I only had it charge
> ?? on the 15A setting, so I knew the fuse would hold up, but still be there
> ?? in case of a dead short.  Most dead shorts are caused because the clips
> ?? touch each other when we're hooking them up.  It never fails!  I always
> ?? wondered why they dont put some covering on the clips so only the teeth
> ?? are bare.  That would not be rocket science either!
> ?
> ?
> ?http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/search/Circuit+Breaker/N0227/C0335.oap
> ?shows 79 in their inventory.  See if any of the local dealers have a
> ?website.
> ?
> ?
> ?   Here are photos of a lot of styles of automotive breakers.  They are
> ?also used on boats.
> ?
> ??https://www.google.com/search?q=Automotive+circuit+breakers?num=100?hl=en?safe=o
> ff?client=firefox-a?hs=LFI?tbo=d?rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official?source=lnms?tbm=i
> sch?sa=X?ei=oK7uUM-8J8Wy0AHJ4YGoBQ?ved=0CAoQ_AUoAA?biw=1280?bih=872?
> ?
> ?   It looks like 35A isn't a common value.
> ?
> ?
> ?
> ?   I used to rebuild some vacuum cleaner motors, and sell them back to
> ?the guy who gave them to me as scrap.  He was convinced that I had an
> ?armature lathe to clean up the commutators.  I used a large ink eraser
> ?to polish the contacts ? a modified Exacto knife blade to undercut the
> ?mica. Drop in a new set of brushes, and maybe a new bearing and they
> ?were ready for another 10 years of reliable service.
> 
> Although the local auto parts stores said they did not have them, I went
> to NAPA and asked to see the auto fuses.  They had them right there on
> the rack, but not 35A.  They had 30A and 40A.  I decided to better
> protect the charger, I'd go with the 30A.  It's installed, the charger
> works fine on the 2A and 15A settings.  I have not yet tried it on the
> 100A setting because there are no really discharged batteries at the
> moment.
> 
> Using your link,
> It looks like this one:
> http://www.optifuse.com/Images/acb-h.jpg
> 
> 35A does appear to be an oddball size.
> 
> The one thing I found a little puzzling was the silver and copper
> colored studs.  I didn't know there was a polarity to these, but I
> connected it the same way (colors) as the original one.
> 
> I still cant understand how they rate this one at 100A when it only had
> a 35A breaker, I can only assume it's like they rate audio amps.  Rather
> than RMS, it's peak.  So the charger can put out 100A for a brief amount
> of time when the car is being started.  (just a guess).


   They are thermal breakers, with a time constant.  The 100A mode is
for a quick attempt to start a car with a low battery.  The starter
should be run for more than a few seconds at a time.  By the time a 100A
breaker would trip, the charger would be damaged, possibly beyond
economical repair.

 
> Now I'll have to dig out the other 2 or 3 dead battery chargers I got
> laying around, and see if I can fix them.  I know for fact that one of
> them needed a breaker, but I could not identify the size and the charger
> is some generic no name brand.  I think it's a 10A charger, so I'd guess
> a 10A breaker would work.  Since it's winter, now is a good time to fix
> items like this.  In warm weather I'm too busy with big projects.


   Winter?  I had to fire up the A/C yesterday. :(


> That's a great idea how to clean up those motor commutators.  I've
> rebuilt some motors myself, usually used emory cloth.  Motors are not
> that complicated, it's just having the right equipment, particularly of
> the coils need to be rewound.  That local idiot got all the equipment
> when another business shut down because the owner retired or died....
> That was before I lived here, but I always hear how nice the original
> owner was, and what an asshole this new guy is.


   I run the motors on an isolated, variable DC power supply & polish
the armature while it's running at a low speed.  I junked the burnt
windings, since I gota lot more motors in than I could ever sell.  I
would strip a pile of the same type, and put together as many as I could
with the good parts.  My favorites were the 'Lamb Electric' single &
double stage.  Very common, and easy to repair.  The motors for the
Rainbow paid the best.  New motors were $125 so I cound get $50 for a
rebuild that took 15 minutes.  Sometimes I rebuilt the one they dropped
off, and I always quotes two hours time to fiux one so they didn't get
too pushy.  That way I could do my electronics work, and still have time
to fix one on time. :)