>"This a candidate for "Meaningless Post of the Year" ? "Well I screwed that up royally. Damn send button.
? on old electrolytic caps
Started by ●June 17, 2014
Reply by ●June 18, 20142014-06-18
Reply by ●June 18, 20142014-06-18
On Wed, 18 Jun 2014 17:19:49 -0400, "Maynard A. Philbrook Jr." <jamie_ka1lpa@charter.net> wrote:>In article <b243q9t7gq15ragisjeqisjkn30iib91do@4ax.com>, >jfields@austininstruments.com says... >> The resistance of a capacitor is an entirely different thing, and >> amounts to the leakage current measured through the dielectric with >> a voltage across it. >> >> In terms of goodness, the lower the ESR and the higher the >> resistance the better. >> >> John Fields >> > Could you please clarify that a bit? I am only an >inbred from Maine and I did quite get that one. > >JamieGreetings Jamie, Though I am only a basics electronics kind of guy I do sorta know this. ESR is Equivalent Series Resistance and plain old resistance is resistance to the flow of DC. So an ohm meter will measure the resistance to DC, which should be high. The ESR is not measured with DC, but with AC. And AC should be able to go through the cap easily while it should block DC. I think I got that right. Eric
Reply by ●June 18, 20142014-06-18
In article <vib4q9pk9a7ei9sdhcpafe8eqpp91qk0tu@4ax.com>, etpm@whidbey.com says...> > On Wed, 18 Jun 2014 17:19:49 -0400, "Maynard A. Philbrook Jr." > <jamie_ka1lpa@charter.net> wrote: > > >In article <b243q9t7gq15ragisjeqisjkn30iib91do@4ax.com>, > >jfields@austininstruments.com says... > >> The resistance of a capacitor is an entirely different thing, and > >> amounts to the leakage current measured through the dielectric with > >> a voltage across it. > >> > >> In terms of goodness, the lower the ESR and the higher the > >> resistance the better. > >> > >> John Fields > >> > > Could you please clarify that a bit? I am only an > >inbred from Maine and I did quite get that one. > > > >Jamie > Greetings Jamie, > Though I am only a basics electronics kind of guy I do sorta know > this. ESR is Equivalent Series Resistance and plain old resistance is > resistance to the flow of DC. So an ohm meter will measure the > resistance to DC, which should be high. The ESR is not measured with > DC, but with AC. And AC should be able to go through the cap easily > while it should block DC. I think I got that right. > EricYou know if "Leakage" resistance was put in the statement, I may have understood that.:) Jamie
Reply by ●June 19, 20142014-06-19
On Wed, 18 Jun 2014 17:19:49 -0400, "Maynard A. Philbrook Jr." <jamie_ka1lpa@charter.net> wrote:>In article <b243q9t7gq15ragisjeqisjkn30iib91do@4ax.com>, >jfields@austininstruments.com says... >> The resistance of a capacitor is an entirely different thing, and >> amounts to the leakage current measured through the dielectric with >> a voltage across it. >> >> In terms of goodness, the lower the ESR and the higher the >> resistance the better. >> >> John Fields >> > Could you please clarify that a bit? I am only an >inbred from Maine and I did quite get that one. > >Jamie--- If you did "quite get" it, why is clarification necessary? John Fields
Reply by ●June 19, 20142014-06-19
On Wed, 18 Jun 2014 22:24:02 -0400, "Maynard A. Philbrook Jr." <jamie_ka1lpa@charter.net> wrote:>In article <vib4q9pk9a7ei9sdhcpafe8eqpp91qk0tu@4ax.com>, >etpm@whidbey.com says... >> >> On Wed, 18 Jun 2014 17:19:49 -0400, "Maynard A. Philbrook Jr." >> <jamie_ka1lpa@charter.net> wrote: >> >> >In article <b243q9t7gq15ragisjeqisjkn30iib91do@4ax.com>, >> >jfields@austininstruments.com says... >> >> The resistance of a capacitor is an entirely different thing, and >> >> amounts to the leakage current measured through the dielectric with >> >> a voltage across it. >> >> >> >> In terms of goodness, the lower the ESR and the higher the >> >> resistance the better. >> >> >> >> John Fields >> >> >> > Could you please clarify that a bit? I am only an >> >inbred from Maine and I did quite get that one. >> > >> >Jamie >> Greetings Jamie, >> Though I am only a basics electronics kind of guy I do sorta know >> this. ESR is Equivalent Series Resistance and plain old resistance is >> resistance to the flow of DC. So an ohm meter will measure the >> resistance to DC, which should be high. The ESR is not measured with >> DC, but with AC. And AC should be able to go through the cap easily >> while it should block DC. I think I got that right. >> Eric > > You know if "Leakage" resistance was put in the statement, I may have >understood that.:) > >Jamie--- Doesn't Ohm's law work in Maine? John Fields
Reply by ●June 19, 20142014-06-19
"John Fields" <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote in message news:si75q9p07h0gqirhan0eigcj3p9nj4ghoo@4ax.com...> On Wed, 18 Jun 2014 17:19:49 -0400, "Maynard A. Philbrook Jr." > <jamie_ka1lpa@charter.net> wrote: > >>In article <b243q9t7gq15ragisjeqisjkn30iib91do@4ax.com>, >>jfields@austininstruments.com says... >>> The resistance of a capacitor is an entirely different thing, and >>> amounts to the leakage current measured through the dielectric with >>> a voltage across it. >>> >>> In terms of goodness, the lower the ESR and the higher the >>> resistance the better. >>> >>> John Fields >>> >> Could you please clarify that a bit? I am only an >>inbred from Maine and I did quite get that one. >> >>Jamie > > --- > If you did "quite get" it, why is clarification necessary? > > John Fieldshttps://www.dropbox.com/s/cijji0j8kllix51/cap.jpg For reference Rick
Reply by ●June 19, 20142014-06-19
On 2014-06-18, Phil Allison <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote:> ><jurb6006@gmail.com> >> >> Actually ESR should be one tenth of Xc or less. >> > > > ** Huh ????Looks like he was aiming for "Zc" but missed -- umop apisdn --- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: news@netfront.net ---
Reply by ●June 19, 20142014-06-19
"Jasen Bleats" <jasen@xnet.co.nz>> > Phil Allison > >><jurb6006@gmail.com> >>> >>> Actually ESR should be one tenth of Xc or less. >>>>> >> ** Huh ???? > > Looks like he was aiming for "Zc" but missed** Now that is the "Dumbest Post of the Year" Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh Plop. .... Phil
Reply by ●June 19, 20142014-06-19
Maynard A. Philbrook Jr. <jamie_ka1lpa@charter.net> wrote:> In article <b243q9t7gq15ragisjeqisjkn30iib91do@4ax.com>, > jfields@austininstruments.com says... >> The resistance of a capacitor is an entirely different thing, and >> amounts to the leakage current measured through the dielectric with >> a voltage across it. >> >> In terms of goodness, the lower the ESR and the higher the >> resistance the better. >> >> John Fields >> > Could you please clarify that a bit? I am only an > inbred from Maine and I did quite get that one.If you take an electronic device, even something simple like a battery there are still losses inside the device from the wiring, connections and other electrochemical stuff going on inside the device. Those internal losses are what's called ESR. For instance, if you short out a AAA battery you will get less current than if you short out a D cell, even though both can in theory output 1.5V. The D cell has beefier internal construction and offers a lower internal resistance, so more current can be drawn from it. The tricky part is a battery, (or capacitor or anything really) is not a plain resistor, so you can't measure this "equivalent" value with an ohm meter, but if you could, the result would be the ESR. In capacitors, you generally want the lowest possible ESR. A cap with a high ESR is old, failing, cheap or just junk, and it can potentially heat up during use, just like a resistor. Heat makes electrolytic capacitors dry up, which increased the ESR, which make them heat up more, until they explore or just stop being capacitors.
Reply by ●June 19, 20142014-06-19
On Thu, 19 Jun 2014 17:19:00 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader <presence@MUNGEpanix.com> wrote:>Maynard A. Philbrook Jr. <jamie_ka1lpa@charter.net> wrote: >> In article <b243q9t7gq15ragisjeqisjkn30iib91do@4ax.com>, >> jfields@austininstruments.com says... >>> The resistance of a capacitor is an entirely different thing, and >>> amounts to the leakage current measured through the dielectric with >>> a voltage across it. >>> >>> In terms of goodness, the lower the ESR and the higher the >>> resistance the better. >>> >>> John Fields >>> >> Could you please clarify that a bit? I am only an >> inbred from Maine and I did quite get that one. > >If you take an electronic device, even something simple like a battery >there are still losses inside the device from the wiring, connections and >other electrochemical stuff going on inside the device. > >Those internal losses are what's called ESR. For instance, if you short >out a AAA battery you will get less current than if you short out a D >cell, even though both can in theory output 1.5V. The D cell has beefier >internal construction and offers a lower internal resistance, so more >current can be drawn from it. > >The tricky part is a battery, (or capacitor or anything really) is not a >plain resistor, so you can't measure this "equivalent" value with an ohm >meter, but if you could, the result would be the ESR. > >In capacitors, you generally want the lowest possible ESR. A cap with a >high ESR is old, failing, cheap or just junk, and it can potentially heat >up during use, just like a resistor. Heat makes electrolytic capacitors >dry up, which increased the ESR, which make them heat up more, until they >explore or just stop being capacitors.--- Right. They turn into explorers. ;) John Fields
