On Fri, 22 Feb 2013 06:49:54 -0800 (PST), George Herold <gherold@teachspin.com> wrote:>On Feb 21, 1:07�pm, DaveC <inva...@invalid.net> wrote: >> > Regular Formvar doesn't >> > dissolve in solder. >> > ...Jim Thompson >> >> For which you would recommend...? > >They make 'nasty' chemicals that will strip the enamel. But for >relatively big wires I just burn it off with a butane torch/ lighter. >For the fine wire the burn method is a bit dodgy, 'cause you can melt >the copper too... turns into a little copper ball on the end of the >wire. > >Goerge H.Yep, a nice little _green_ ball :-( ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.
How to solder very thin stranded wire?
Started by ●February 21, 2013
Reply by ●February 22, 20132013-02-22
Reply by ●February 22, 20132013-02-22
On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 10:16:08 -0700, Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote:>On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 09:05:25 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote: > >>On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 06:41:32 -0800 (PST), George Herold >><gherold@teachspin.com> wrote: >> >>>On Feb 21, 2:06�am, DaveC <inva...@invalid.net> wrote: >>>> This is one conductor in a cable from some iPod earphones: >>>> >>>> http://www.tinyuploads.com/images/mizPu4.jpg >>>> >>>> What is the best way to deal with the fibre strands and to tin the wire? >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> Dave >>> >>>I did something like that... I just teased the wire away from the >>>fibers, cut the fibers, and the enamel on the wire burned off from the >>>heat of the soldering iron. >>> >>>George H. >>I don't even bother to try to tease the fibers away. I just get a good >>blob of solder on the tip of the iron and push the wire into it. In my >>experience everything burns away except the wire. >>Eric > >That works for "SolderEze" coated wire. Regular Formvar doesn't >dissolve in solder. > > ...Jim ThompsonThe enamel and the fibers don't dissolve in the solder, they just burn away. And it's not instant, the removal of the varnish and tinning of the strands. Sometimes I need to add more solder as the varnish and fibers burn away. I've never heard of SolderEze coated wire. It sounds like useful stuff. I'm gonna look for some. Thanks, Eric
Reply by ●February 22, 20132013-02-22
On Fri, 22 Feb 2013 08:44:21 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote:>On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 10:16:08 -0700, Jim Thompson ><To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: > >>On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 09:05:25 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote: >> >>>On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 06:41:32 -0800 (PST), George Herold >>><gherold@teachspin.com> wrote: >>> >>>>On Feb 21, 2:06�am, DaveC <inva...@invalid.net> wrote: >>>>> This is one conductor in a cable from some iPod earphones: >>>>> >>>>> http://www.tinyuploads.com/images/mizPu4.jpg >>>>> >>>>> What is the best way to deal with the fibre strands and to tin the wire? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> Dave >>>> >>>>I did something like that... I just teased the wire away from the >>>>fibers, cut the fibers, and the enamel on the wire burned off from the >>>>heat of the soldering iron. >>>> >>>>George H. >>>I don't even bother to try to tease the fibers away. I just get a good >>>blob of solder on the tip of the iron and push the wire into it. In my >>>experience everything burns away except the wire. >>>Eric >> >>That works for "SolderEze" coated wire. Regular Formvar doesn't >>dissolve in solder. >> >> ...Jim Thompson >The enamel and the fibers don't dissolve in the solder, they just burn >away. And it's not instant, the removal of the varnish and tinning of >the strands. Sometimes I need to add more solder as the varnish and >fibers burn away. I've never heard of SolderEze coated wire. It sounds >like useful stuff. I'm gonna look for some. >Thanks, >EricIt may not even exist anymore. I last used it in 1987, when I was at GenRad, Phoenix. I found this link.... http://www.avrfreaks.net/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=printview&t=44715&start=0 which implies it's no more. ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.
Reply by ●February 22, 20132013-02-22
On Fri, 22 Feb 2013 08:44:21 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote:>On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 10:16:08 -0700, Jim Thompson ><To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: > >>On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 09:05:25 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote: >> >>>On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 06:41:32 -0800 (PST), George Herold >>><gherold@teachspin.com> wrote: >>> >>>>On Feb 21, 2:06�am, DaveC <inva...@invalid.net> wrote: >>>>> This is one conductor in a cable from some iPod earphones: >>>>> >>>>> http://www.tinyuploads.com/images/mizPu4.jpg >>>>> >>>>> What is the best way to deal with the fibre strands and to tin the wire? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> Dave >>>> >>>>I did something like that... I just teased the wire away from the >>>>fibers, cut the fibers, and the enamel on the wire burned off from the >>>>heat of the soldering iron. >>>> >>>>George H. >>>I don't even bother to try to tease the fibers away. I just get a good >>>blob of solder on the tip of the iron and push the wire into it. In my >>>experience everything burns away except the wire. >>>Eric >> >>That works for "SolderEze" coated wire. Regular Formvar doesn't >>dissolve in solder. >> >> ...Jim Thompson >The enamel and the fibers don't dissolve in the solder, they just burn >away. And it's not instant, the removal of the varnish and tinning of >the strands. Sometimes I need to add more solder as the varnish and >fibers burn away. I've never heard of SolderEze coated wire. It sounds >like useful stuff. I'm gonna look for some. >Thanks, >Eric--- Several of the polyurethane and polyester films used to insulate magnet wire melt easily and allow for quick soldering: http://www.mwswire.com/pdf_files/mws_tech_book/page2_3.pdf -- JF
Reply by ●February 23, 20132013-02-23
On 2/22/2013 11:52 AM, Jim Thompson wrote:> On Fri, 22 Feb 2013 08:44:21 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote: > >> On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 10:16:08 -0700, Jim Thompson >> <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote: >> >>> On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 09:05:25 -0800, etpm@whidbey.com wrote: >>> >>>> On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 06:41:32 -0800 (PST), George Herold >>>> <gherold@teachspin.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> On Feb 21, 2:06 am, DaveC <inva...@invalid.net> wrote: >>>>>> This is one conductor in a cable from some iPod earphones: >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.tinyuploads.com/images/mizPu4.jpg >>>>>> >>>>>> What is the best way to deal with the fibre strands and to tin the wire? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> Dave >>>>> >>>>> I did something like that... I just teased the wire away from the >>>>> fibers, cut the fibers, and the enamel on the wire burned off from the >>>>> heat of the soldering iron. >>>>> >>>>> George H. >>>> I don't even bother to try to tease the fibers away. I just get a good >>>> blob of solder on the tip of the iron and push the wire into it. In my >>>> experience everything burns away except the wire. >>>> Eric >>> >>> That works for "SolderEze" coated wire. Regular Formvar doesn't >>> dissolve in solder. >>> >>> ...Jim Thompson >> The enamel and the fibers don't dissolve in the solder, they just burn >> away. And it's not instant, the removal of the varnish and tinning of >> the strands. Sometimes I need to add more solder as the varnish and >> fibers burn away. I've never heard of SolderEze coated wire. It sounds >> like useful stuff. I'm gonna look for some. >> Thanks, >> Eric > > It may not even exist anymore. I last used it in 1987, when I was at > GenRad, Phoenix. > > I found this link.... > > http://www.avrfreaks.net/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=printview&t=44715&start=0 > > which implies it's no more. > > ...Jim Thompson >Interesting. I find that they still sell "solderable Beldsol", which is specified to solder without stripping at 750 F. A bit hotter iron than usual, but no blue flames required. Cheers Phil Hobbs -- Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics 160 North State Road #203 Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 USA +1 845 480 2058 hobbs at electrooptical dot net http://electrooptical.net
Reply by ●February 23, 20132013-02-23
On Fri, 22 Feb 2013 08:56:28 -0500, default <none@noname.net> wrote:>On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 00:50:00 -0800, DaveC <invalid@invalid.net> wrote: > >>> Plan A: Find a short length of very fine uninsulated wire. A single >>> strand from some stranded wire is what I use. Wrap it around the >>> insulation about 2 times, and then continue wrapping around the tinsel >>> wire. Clip off the excess at the end. Solder the wrapped wire to the >>> replacement connector. >> >>Sounds good. >> >>> Plan B: Buy a new iPod earphone. They're cheaper than the replacment >>> connector. >> >>Not using it as earbuds. Just re-purposing the cord for a corded >>single-earphone-with-mic unit. Have both, and am an avid "not to the landfill >>will you go" kind of guy... >> >>And beside, I'll learn something new (ie, soldering tinsel wire). >> >>Dave > >Another problem with very fine wire is that it dissolves in solder.Is this for the same reason solder tips dissolve in solder (slowly). I only use resin core, never acid core, and still the tips disappear after years. I wouldn't mind except I had trouble finding new screw-on tips a few years ago, because in the hobbyist-priced irons they've gone back to screw-in tips.>They do make/sell solders with high copper content to deal with that. >Ersin "savebit" is one such (sold with the idea that soldering iron >bits will dissolve or erode more slowly if the solder already contains >copper.
Reply by ●February 24, 20132013-02-24
On Sat, 23 Feb 2013 16:26:03 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@bigfoot.com> wrote in message news:vqcii858f6mpboih7h3kft1ipmnk4v0io4@4ax.com> On Fri, 22 Feb 2013 08:56:28 -0500, default <none@noname.net> wrote: > > >On Thu, 21 Feb 2013 00:50:00 -0800, DaveC <invalid@invalid.net> wrote: > > > >>> Plan A: Find a short length of very fine uninsulated wire. A single > >>> strand from some stranded wire is what I use. Wrap it around the > >>> insulation about 2 times, and then continue wrapping around the tinsel > >>> wire. Clip off the excess at the end. Solder the wrapped wire to the > >>> replacement connector. > >> > >>Sounds good. > >> > >>> Plan B: Buy a new iPod earphone. They're cheaper than the replacment > >>> connector. > >> > >>Not using it as earbuds. Just re-purposing the cord for a corded > >>single-earphone-with-mic unit. Have both, and am an avid "not to thelandfill> >>will you go" kind of guy... > >> > >>And beside, I'll learn something new (ie, soldering tinsel wire). > >> > >>Dave > > > >Another problem with very fine wire is that it dissolves in solder. > > Is this for the same reason solder tips dissolve in solder (slowly).That is the theory... If you slowly feed something like 32 or higher AWG wire onto a hot, heavily tinned, tip you can watch it dissapear.> > I only use resin core, never acid core, and still the tips disappear > after years. I wouldn't mind except I had trouble finding new > screw-on tips a few years ago, because in the hobbyist-priced irons > they've gone back to screw-in tips. > > >They do make/sell solders with high copper content to deal with that. > >Ersin "savebit" is one such (sold with the idea that soldering iron > >bits will dissolve or erode more slowly if the solder already contains > >copper. >
Reply by ●February 24, 20132013-02-24
On 24 Feb 2013 16:47:58 GMT, "Default" <none@noname.net> wrote:>That is the theory... If you slowly feed something like 32 or higher >AWG wire onto a hot, heavily tinned, tip you can watch it dissapear.I just tried it with one strand from 24 AWG stranded wire, which is made from 7 strands of 32 AWG. I held the iron on the wire for about 5 minutes and nothing disappeared. Perhaps it's because my soldering iron tip runs at about 400 C while copper melts at about 1085 C? -- Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
Reply by ●February 24, 20132013-02-24
On Sun, 24 Feb 2013 12:36:51 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:>On 24 Feb 2013 16:47:58 GMT, "Default" <none@noname.net> wrote: > >>That is the theory... If you slowly feed something like 32 or higher >>AWG wire onto a hot, heavily tinned, tip you can watch it dissapear. > >I just tried it with one strand from 24 AWG stranded wire, which is >made from 7 strands of 32 AWG. I held the iron on the wire for about >5 minutes and nothing disappeared. Perhaps it's because my soldering >iron tip runs at about 400 C while copper melts at about 1085 C?--- It's not so much about the melting point of copper as it about copper dissolving into a molten tin - lead alloy. An analogy might be sugar dissolving into water far below sugar's melting point. -- JF
Reply by ●February 25, 20132013-02-25
On Sun, 24 Feb 2013 16:29:46 -0600, John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:>On Sun, 24 Feb 2013 12:36:51 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> >wrote: > >>On 24 Feb 2013 16:47:58 GMT, "Default" <none@noname.net> wrote: >> >>>That is the theory... If you slowly feed something like 32 or higher >>>AWG wire onto a hot, heavily tinned, tip you can watch it dissapear. >> >>I just tried it with one strand from 24 AWG stranded wire, which is >>made from 7 strands of 32 AWG. I held the iron on the wire for about >>5 minutes and nothing disappeared. Perhaps it's because my soldering >>iron tip runs at about 400 C while copper melts at about 1085 C?>It's not so much about the melting point of copper as it about copper >dissolving into a molten tin - lead alloy. > >An analogy might be sugar dissolving into water far below sugar's >melting point.Thanks. That makes sense, but I'm still skeptical. So, I tried it again, this time with a thicker #28 bare copper wire on both my 750F lead-tin (60/40) iron tip and my 850F RoHS tip. 15 minutes of applied heat and I get the same result as before... nothing happened (except a well tinned piece of wire and a pile of dross). Digging, I found: "Properties of Alloys of Multicore.. Solder Wires" <https://www.distrelec.cz/ishop/Datasheets/M-POFA_eng_datasheet.pdf> Multicore Savbit Solder is produced especially to overcome the problem of ordinary tin/lead solders dissolving copper. It is an alloy to which a precise amount of copper has been added so that no further copper absorption should take place during soldering. From the graph, it appears that pure tin is the worst, with 60/40 being a close second. However, if there's any copper in the solder, the copper wire doesn't want to dissolve. I'm not sure what's in the RoHS solder on my bench. The label fell off long ago. I'll find some more that doesn't have copper in it and see what happens. I'll see if I can find some finer wire and try again. I want to see the wire "disappear". -- Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
