On Tue, 20 Dec 2022 17:21:03 -0000 (UTC), "Don" <g@crcomp.net> wrote:
>Phil Hobbs wrote:
>> Don wrote:
>>> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>>> John Larkin wrote:
>>>
>>> <snip>
>>>
>>>>> I lost a weekend building two of those for ASML. It's technically
>>>>> "Manhattan Style", little FR4 platforms. You can make nice 50 ohm
>>>>> transmission lines that way, about 120 mils wide using 0.062 thick
>>>>> FR4.
>>>>
>>>> Its nice, combining all those small boards!
>>>> In my case many of the chip adaptors have .1 inch spacing pins so they
>>>> fit nicely in the 'veroboard' holes.
>>>> Wires and SMDs directly soldered between the round isles, even the edge
>>>> connectors fit.
>>>
>>> My MP3 player uses Neo-Manhattan:
>>>
>>> <https://crcomp.net/mp3mod/neomanhattan.png>
>>>
>>> A reworked Universal board will soon replace the green PCB shown above.
>>> The new Universal prototype will then be bolted to the substrate.
>>> Manhattan only works for me near the end of my iterative prototype
>>> process. YYMV.
>>>
>> Bowery, very bowery. ;)
>
>It's substance over style, for the time being. Although Muse, my MP3
>player, may now be covered in soot (or rather Gorilla duct tape adhesive
>remnants) she'll soon sparkle more than Cinderella. Shortly she'll sport
>a shiny new Universal top and then get cleaned up for her final photo.
>
>Danke,
We have a PCB solvent washing machine down in production that I am
technically not allowed to use. It takes the flux and sharpie marks
off my protos and makes them glitter.
I use 63/37 solder of course. Shiny.
Reply by John Larkin●December 20, 20222022-12-20
On Tue, 20 Dec 2022 10:40:16 -0500, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:
>John Larkin wrote:
>> On Tue, 20 Dec 2022 10:27:27 -0500, Phil Hobbs
>> <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Don wrote:
>>>> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>>>> John Larkin wrote:
>>>>
>>>> <snip>
>>>>
>>>>>> I lost a weekend building two of those for ASML. It's technically
>>>>>> "Manhattan Style", little FR4 platforms. You can make nice 50 ohm
>>>>>> transmission lines that way, about 120 mils wide using 0.062 thick
>>>>>> FR4.
>>>>>
>>>>> Its nice, combining all those small boards!
>>>>> In my case many of the chip adaptors have .1 inch spacing pins so they
>>>>> fit nicely in the 'veroboard' holes.
>>>>> Wires and SMDs directly soldered between the round isles, even the edge
>>>>> connectors fit.
>>>>
>>>> My MP3 player uses Neo-Manhattan:
>>>>
>>>> <https://crcomp.net/mp3mod/neomanhattan.png>
>>>>
>>>> A reworked Universal board will soon replace the green PCB shown above.
>>>> The new Universal prototype will then be bolted to the substrate.
>>>> Manhattan only works for me near the end of my iterative prototype
>>>> process. YYMV.
>>>>
>>>> Danke,
>>>>
>>> Bowery, very bowery. ;)
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>>
>>> Phil Hobbs
>>
>> My style is more Battery Park.
>>
>
>Nah, with all that bling you're definitely Fifth Avenue. (Not my
>natural habitat.) ;)
Breadboards At Tiffany's.
>
>Cheers
>
>Phil "The only good bug is a dead bug" Hobbs
Insect abuse.
Reply by Don●December 20, 20222022-12-20
Phil Hobbs wrote:
> Don wrote:
>> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>> John Larkin wrote:
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>>>> I lost a weekend building two of those for ASML. It's technically
>>>> "Manhattan Style", little FR4 platforms. You can make nice 50 ohm
>>>> transmission lines that way, about 120 mils wide using 0.062 thick
>>>> FR4.
>>>
>>> Its nice, combining all those small boards!
>>> In my case many of the chip adaptors have .1 inch spacing pins so they
>>> fit nicely in the 'veroboard' holes.
>>> Wires and SMDs directly soldered between the round isles, even the edge
>>> connectors fit.
>>
>> My MP3 player uses Neo-Manhattan:
>>
>> <https://crcomp.net/mp3mod/neomanhattan.png>
>>
>> A reworked Universal board will soon replace the green PCB shown above.
>> The new Universal prototype will then be bolted to the substrate.
>> Manhattan only works for me near the end of my iterative prototype
>> process. YYMV.
>>
> Bowery, very bowery. ;)
It's substance over style, for the time being. Although Muse, my MP3
player, may now be covered in soot (or rather Gorilla duct tape adhesive
remnants) she'll soon sparkle more than Cinderella. Shortly she'll sport
a shiny new Universal top and then get cleaned up for her final photo.
Danke,
--
Don, KB7RPU, https://www.qsl.net/kb7rpu
There was a young lady named Bright Whose speed was far faster than light;
She set out one day In a relative way And returned on the previous night.
Reply by Phil Hobbs●December 20, 20222022-12-20
John Larkin wrote:
> On Tue, 20 Dec 2022 10:27:27 -0500, Phil Hobbs
> <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:
>
>> Don wrote:
>>> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>>> John Larkin wrote:
>>>
>>> <snip>
>>>
>>>>> I lost a weekend building two of those for ASML. It's technically
>>>>> "Manhattan Style", little FR4 platforms. You can make nice 50 ohm
>>>>> transmission lines that way, about 120 mils wide using 0.062 thick
>>>>> FR4.
>>>>
>>>> Its nice, combining all those small boards!
>>>> In my case many of the chip adaptors have .1 inch spacing pins so they
>>>> fit nicely in the 'veroboard' holes.
>>>> Wires and SMDs directly soldered between the round isles, even the edge
>>>> connectors fit.
>>>
>>> My MP3 player uses Neo-Manhattan:
>>>
>>> <https://crcomp.net/mp3mod/neomanhattan.png>
>>>
>>> A reworked Universal board will soon replace the green PCB shown above.
>>> The new Universal prototype will then be bolted to the substrate.
>>> Manhattan only works for me near the end of my iterative prototype
>>> process. YYMV.
>>>
>>> Danke,
>>>
>> Bowery, very bowery. ;)
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Phil Hobbs
>
> My style is more Battery Park.
>
Nah, with all that bling you're definitely Fifth Avenue. (Not my
natural habitat.) ;)
Cheers
Phil "The only good bug is a dead bug" Hobbs
--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510
http://electrooptical.nethttp://hobbs-eo.com
Reply by John Larkin●December 20, 20222022-12-20
On Tue, 20 Dec 2022 10:27:27 -0500, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:
>Don wrote:
>> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>> John Larkin wrote:
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>>>> I lost a weekend building two of those for ASML. It's technically
>>>> "Manhattan Style", little FR4 platforms. You can make nice 50 ohm
>>>> transmission lines that way, about 120 mils wide using 0.062 thick
>>>> FR4.
>>>
>>> Its nice, combining all those small boards!
>>> In my case many of the chip adaptors have .1 inch spacing pins so they
>>> fit nicely in the 'veroboard' holes.
>>> Wires and SMDs directly soldered between the round isles, even the edge
>>> connectors fit.
>>
>> My MP3 player uses Neo-Manhattan:
>>
>> <https://crcomp.net/mp3mod/neomanhattan.png>
>>
>> A reworked Universal board will soon replace the green PCB shown above.
>> The new Universal prototype will then be bolted to the substrate.
>> Manhattan only works for me near the end of my iterative prototype
>> process. YYMV.
>>
>> Danke,
>>
>Bowery, very bowery. ;)
>
>Cheers
>
>Phil Hobbs
My style is more Battery Park.
Reply by Phil Hobbs●December 20, 20222022-12-20
Don wrote:
> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>> John Larkin wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>>> I lost a weekend building two of those for ASML. It's technically
>>> "Manhattan Style", little FR4 platforms. You can make nice 50 ohm
>>> transmission lines that way, about 120 mils wide using 0.062 thick
>>> FR4.
>>
>> Its nice, combining all those small boards!
>> In my case many of the chip adaptors have .1 inch spacing pins so they
>> fit nicely in the 'veroboard' holes.
>> Wires and SMDs directly soldered between the round isles, even the edge
>> connectors fit.
>
> My MP3 player uses Neo-Manhattan:
>
> <https://crcomp.net/mp3mod/neomanhattan.png>
>
> A reworked Universal board will soon replace the green PCB shown above.
> The new Universal prototype will then be bolted to the substrate.
> Manhattan only works for me near the end of my iterative prototype
> process. YYMV.
>
> Danke,
>
Bowery, very bowery. ;)
Cheers
Phil Hobbs
Reply by Jan Panteltje●December 20, 20222022-12-20
On a sunny day (Mon, 19 Dec 2022 18:33:09 -0000 (UTC)) it happened "Don"
<g@crcomp.net> wrote in <20221219a@crcomp.net>:
>Jan Panteltje wrote:
>> John Larkin wrote:
>
><snip>
>
>>>I lost a weekend building two of those for ASML. It's technically
>>>"Manhattan Style", little FR4 platforms. You can make nice 50 ohm
>>>transmission lines that way, about 120 mils wide using 0.062 thick
>>>FR4.
>>
>> Its nice, combining all those small boards!
>> In my case many of the chip adaptors have .1 inch spacing pins so they
>> fit nicely in the 'veroboard' holes.
>> Wires and SMDs directly soldered between the round isles, even the edge
>> connectors fit.
>
>My MP3 player uses Neo-Manhattan:
>
><https://crcomp.net/mp3mod/neomanhattan.png>
Ah! Nice :-)
Reply by Don●December 19, 20222022-12-19
Jan Panteltje wrote:
> John Larkin wrote:
<snip>
>>I lost a weekend building two of those for ASML. It's technically
>>"Manhattan Style", little FR4 platforms. You can make nice 50 ohm
>>transmission lines that way, about 120 mils wide using 0.062 thick
>>FR4.
>
> Its nice, combining all those small boards!
> In my case many of the chip adaptors have .1 inch spacing pins so they
> fit nicely in the 'veroboard' holes.
> Wires and SMDs directly soldered between the round isles, even the edge
> connectors fit.
My MP3 player uses Neo-Manhattan:
<https://crcomp.net/mp3mod/neomanhattan.png>
A reworked Universal board will soon replace the green PCB shown above.
The new Universal prototype will then be bolted to the substrate.
Manhattan only works for me near the end of my iterative prototype
process. YYMV.
Danke,
--
Don, KB7RPU, https://www.qsl.net/kb7rpu
There was a young lady named Bright Whose speed was far faster than light;
She set out one day In a relative way And returned on the previous night.
Reply by John Larkin●December 19, 20222022-12-19
On Mon, 19 Dec 2022 03:51:09 -0800 (PST), John Walliker
<jrwalliker@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Monday, 19 December 2022 at 07:09:48 UTC, Jan Panteltje wrote:
>> On a sunny day (Sun, 18 Dec 2022 08:11:19 -0800) it happened John Larkin
>> <jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
>> <tjduph94f8phnba1c...@4ax.com>:
>> >On Sun, 18 Dec 2022 07:14:23 GMT, Jan Panteltje
>> ><pNaonSt...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >>On a sunny day (Sat, 17 Dec 2022 09:32:51 -0800) it happened John Larkin
>> >><jla...@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> wrote in
>> >><nitrph9i9g3ervse2...@4ax.com>:
>> >>
>> >>>On Sat, 17 Dec 2022 05:46:35 GMT, Jan Panteltje
>> >>><pNaonSt...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >>>>>I don't think the inductor would be a practical size.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>Resistor?
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>>Here's my soft-start board.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>https://www.dropbox.com/s/hoicw55p91d9muc/99S544A1.pdf?dl=0
>> >>>>Says item was deleted
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>Try this:
>> >>>
>> >>>https://www.dropbox.com/sh/96adbwr9utgwom0/AACHgFwNj9MKWIxDHAZi-KYNa?dl=0
>> >>
>> >>OK, that will work, short dissipation in the MOSFET during the ramp.
>> >>When switching in a resistro during filter capacitor charge would work too.
>> >>I understood from your posting that at startup there is no other load?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >200 uF of capacitance and maybe 100 mA of stuff on the load side,
>> >power for some isolators and a bit of logic.
>> >
>> >Yes, we could charge up the loads through a power resistor that is
>> >shorted by a fet after a second or so. That would be simpler than my
>> >cicuit. I'd still need an over-48-volt supply if I use an n-channel
>> >fet, or buy a really low Ron p-fet.
>> >
>> >
>> >>>
>> >>>Another recent discovery is that we need schottky diodes in parallel
>> >>>with the mosfet substate diodes in the h-bridges. Weird things were
>> >>>happening during the anti-shoot-through times of the LTC4444 driver
>> >>>chips. I've seen mosfet substrate diodes decide to act like high-power
>> >>>step-recovery diodes.
>> >>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>>It bolts onto the power supply board where the fuseholder used to be.
>> >>>>>It replicates the fuse and adds the soft start, under FPGA control.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>I like to lay out a small board now and then.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>Most things I do these days are hobby related on veroboard stuff...
>> >>>>Even giggle Hertz stuff..
>> >>>
>> >>>Dremel!
>> >>>
>> >>>https://www.dropbox.com/s/pa9mu4ehtrjei8m/Z384_1.JPG?raw=1
>> >>
>> >>Yes, nice, and gold!
>> >>
>> >>http://panteltje.com/panteltje/raspberry_pi_dvb-s_transmitter/
>> >>scroll down for board, the GHz stuff is bottom right,
>> >>In those boards the SMDs fit exactly between 2 isles, many here,
>> >>and you can make your 'waveguides' in 3 D...
>> >>
>> >>http://panteltje.com/pub/2.4GHz_SWR_reflected_with_directional_coupler_IMG_5102.JPG
>> >>http://panteltje.com/pub/2.4_GHz_to_1.5_GHz_down_converter_closeup_IMG_4660.JPG
>> >>http://panteltje.com/pub/added_2.4_GHz_VCO_IMG_4620.JPG
>> >>http://panteltje.com/pub/2.4_GHz_VCO_via_coax_IMG_4624.JPG
>> >
>> >
>> >That style of construction confuses me. Dead bug confuses me too. I
>> >prefer
>> >
>> >https://www.dropbox.com/s/9av93ul8148zdjm/Z356_SN2.JPG?raw=1
>> >
>> >I lost a weekend building two of those for ASML. It's technically
>> >"Manhattan Style", little FR4 platforms. You can make nice 50 ohm
>> >transmission lines that way, about 120 mils wide using 0.062 thick
>> >FR4.
>> Its nice, combining all those small boards!
>> In my case many of the chip adaptors have .1 inch spacing pins so they
>> fit nicely in the 'veroboard' holes.
>> Wires and SMDs directly soldered between the round isles, even the edge connectors fit.
>>
>>
>> >https://www.dropbox.com/s/yur6uuhytc7cfcn/D200_BB_4.JPG?raw=1
>>
>> Bit wasteful with gold on that high power resistor board? Or is that not gold?
It's ENIG on FR4. Microinches of gold. Every couple of years I have
one of our PCB vendors make me a few square feet of gold-plated FR4.
It looks good, solders great, and doesn't tarnish like bare copper.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/wgzr56dx43z14rp/Gold_FR4_3x.jpg?raw=1
>> The nice thing of those boards with holes I use is that no dremeling in needed.
>> The dremel makes a lot of mess.
It's an art form. Fun.
>> Long time stability is good (but I use 60/40 solder),
Yes!
>> if I use the eurocard format (100 x 160 mm) standard boards
>> then those fit exacty in these casings:
>> http://panteltje.com/panteltje/tri_pic/
>>
>> or
>> http://panteltje.com/pub/8052AH_BASIC_computer/8052AH_BASIC_computer_inside2_img_1757.jpg
>> The thing and its nicad backup battery still working after I build it in the eighties...
>> >https://www.dropbox.com/s/5nlhqy7c8mt2xv3/LDP2.JPG?raw=1
>> >
>> >I just got some 3M Z-axis conductive tape to play with.
>> I need to fix a break in some flex PCB cable in a old eeePC I have..
>> Any idea of some good conductive glue ?
>> >>http://panteltje.com/pub/GPS_jammer_board_twisted_wire_1.57GHz_oscillator_IMG_3622.GIF
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >I'm planning a product line using the Pi Pico as the compute core.
>> >There is an amazing culture around the Pi, a zillion maker-type kids
>> >and school courses. It's sometimed dismissed as a toy but serious
>> >people are making products around Pi's. Every other uP that we have
>> >used has gone EOL anyhow (except, surprisingly, the 68332.)
>> I have never used the Pico, I did see your post in the Raspy group for coffee and tea :-0
>> Yes, much is unobtainable now, seems industrial use of Raspberries is high and
>> gets priority.
>
>There is no shortage of Pico boards. RasPi have enough wafers in stock for 20 million
>chips and more are in the pipeline. There are hundreds of thousands of RP2040
>chips at the usual distributors at the moment.
Last time I checked, Digikey had 19,000 Picos in stock at $4 each.
>
>> I have 5 Raspis in use now, one Pi4 8 GB just used for web browsing and downloads.
>> A Pi4 4 GB does security recording and all sorts of measurements (radiation, weather, GPS, AIS, planes) 24/7.
>> The advantage is the HDMI out and the GPIO connector.
>> A 4 TB USB harddisk is connected to each PI 4.
>> Have ported most stuff I wrote to the Pi now.
>>
>> I may try a Pico one day, but most things can be done with a simple PIC at micro amp use if needed.
>> >
>> >>
>> >>>Has anyone tried the Digikey pc boards?
>> >>>
>> >>>https://www.digikey.com/en/resources/dkred
>> >>
>> >>Interesting
>> >
>> >Looks like a few clicks and a zip file upload will get us cheap boards
>> >in 5 days. I'll try it.
>> Let us know how it pans out!