On Fri, 14 Oct 2022 12:25:15 -0400 (EDT), Martin Rid
<martin_riddle@verison.net> wrote:
>John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> Wrote in message:r
>> On Thu, 13 Oct 2022 21:48:02 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee<edward.ming.lee@gmail.com> wrote:>On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 9:42:21 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:>> I thought I would give Amazon a try and see if the USB flash drives sold there are any better than the crap sold on eBay. Well, it seems not. I picked a drive in a metal case to stand up to a bit of abuse and order two in order to get the free shipping. Amazon makes it hard to get the free shipping without signing up for their master plan that's over $100 a year now. But eventually I got that to work. >> >> So the drives came today and I plugged on in to be tested with H2testw. Of course it failed. It seems to be a 32 GB drive doctored to report 512 GB. >> >> The return process involves a QR code that you show to the UPS store, but they don't send it to the phone in a convenient manner. I would have had to use a SD card to move it or I guess I could email it to myself. So I tried calling Amazon to see if they could just email it to
me.
>The person on the phone was a bit hard to understand, but eventually we communicated. In the end, after I asked for this vendor to be reported, she said she would do that and also gave me the refund without a return. >> >> So in the end it worked out, but Amazon doesn't make it easy. I guess if I were a high volume Amazon customer, I would know how to make it all easy, and would also be able to give this outfit a bad review. But I'm not allowed to write reviews until I've spent $50! >> >> So much for buying at Amazon. >>You didn't say how much you paid for them. But from guessing, it's 2x 512G for less than $50. You got what you paid for.Rick's life seems to be centered on cheap. He said his dad was likethat too. Could be hereditary.
>
>I stay away from 'cheep', you waste too much time trying to make
> it work.
>
>Cheers
Or shipping it back to the seller to get your 85 cents back.
Reply by Ricky●October 14, 20222022-10-14
On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 1:23:50 PM UTC-4, Rich S wrote:
> On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 4:35:38 PM UTC, Ricky wrote:
> > On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 11:50:00 AM UTC-4, boB wrote:
> > > On Fri, 14 Oct 2022 06:21:02 -0700 (PDT), Ricky
> > > <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > >On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 4:31:42 AM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
> > > >> On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 11:27:13 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
> > > >> > On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 1:46:06 AM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> > > A good half-terabyte M.2 NVMe drive is about $50, and has four lanes (4x faster than USB-C). Add $20 for
> > > >> > > a USB interface and case, if you want it external and portable. USB cable extra.
> > > >> > I think you mean add nothing for the USB interface and $1 for the "case". This was a USB memory stick, not a hard drive replacement. But thanks for the $50 figure. In the meantime I've wiped an old drive that was storing stuff I don't need anymore.
> > > >> I tried a microSD card with 1 TB for $10-ish, and a USB dock for it for about $1. The SD card, with the same
> > > >> h2testw, actually got to day two of testing (about 300GB) before it faulted. It's not a mislabeled item, or complete fraud,
> > > >> just a low-reliability card (this was Xiaomi brand, and less return-able than an Amazon purchase).
> > > >
> > > >It's pretty inconceivable that a 1TB drive could be sold for $10 unless it used defective chips (rejects). One way or the other, this is a fake part.
> > > I got two of these supposedly 2 TB sticks. They were definitely
> > > fake. I was stupid for even thinking you could get a 2TB stick for
> > > under $75. I'm not sure you can even get one for $750 ??
> > That's the problem. The quality is not related to the price. That's why I test all the flash devices I buy, regardless of price.
> >
> > --
> >
> > Rick C.
> >
> > ++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
> > ++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
> Ah OK so youre looking for intersection of
> - 100% reliability,
> - accurately-stated capacity,
> - and low purchase price.
> Those requirements tend to correlate with established brands
> of product, and reputable vendors.
> User reviews on a platform like Amazon, are poor indicators
> of those factors. (research studies supports that).
> Of course I respect your desire to "test the marketplace" and
> challenge these things :-)
It's weird that you draw the conclusions you do from the post I made.
BTW, the "stated capacity" being faked, doesn't mean you get a smaller device. It means you get a worthless device. If the drive thinks it's 256 GB, but it's only 32 GB, what do you think happens when it tries to write anywhere above 32 GB? That's why all flash drives need to be tested. If they've faked the capacity, it may work for weeks or months before you find it is crapping out in normal use.
Ok, thanks for the comments.
--
Rick C.
--- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
--- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
Reply by John Walliker●October 14, 20222022-10-14
On Friday, 14 October 2022 at 18:23:50 UTC+1, Rich S wrote:
> On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 4:35:38 PM UTC, Ricky wrote:
> > On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 11:50:00 AM UTC-4, boB wrote:
> > > On Fri, 14 Oct 2022 06:21:02 -0700 (PDT), Ricky
> > > <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > >On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 4:31:42 AM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
> > > >> On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 11:27:13 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
> > > >> > On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 1:46:06 AM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> > > A good half-terabyte M.2 NVMe drive is about $50, and has four lanes (4x faster than USB-C). Add $20 for
> > > >> > > a USB interface and case, if you want it external and portable. USB cable extra.
> > > >> > I think you mean add nothing for the USB interface and $1 for the "case". This was a USB memory stick, not a hard drive replacement. But thanks for the $50 figure. In the meantime I've wiped an old drive that was storing stuff I don't need anymore.
> > > >> I tried a microSD card with 1 TB for $10-ish, and a USB dock for it for about $1. The SD card, with the same
> > > >> h2testw, actually got to day two of testing (about 300GB) before it faulted. It's not a mislabeled item, or complete fraud,
> > > >> just a low-reliability card (this was Xiaomi brand, and less return-able than an Amazon purchase).
> > > >
> > > >It's pretty inconceivable that a 1TB drive could be sold for $10 unless it used defective chips (rejects). One way or the other, this is a fake part.
> > > I got two of these supposedly 2 TB sticks. They were definitely
> > > fake. I was stupid for even thinking you could get a 2TB stick for
> > > under $75. I'm not sure you can even get one for $750 ??
> > That's the problem. The quality is not related to the price. That's why I test all the flash devices I buy, regardless of price.
> >
> > --
> >
> > Rick C.
> >
> > ++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
> > ++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
> Ah OK so youre looking for intersection of
> - 100% reliability,
> - accurately-stated capacity,
> - and low purchase price.
> Those requirements tend to correlate with established brands
> of product, and reputable vendors.
> User reviews on a platform like Amazon, are poor indicators
> of those factors. (research studies supports that).
> Of course I respect your desire to "test the marketplace" and
> challenge these things :-)
I recently bought a couple of 1Tbyte SSDs (Samsung 850 PRO) on eBay. One of the
suppliers was impatient for feedback. I told him to wait until I had written a few Tbytes
of random data and verified it (after updating the firmware and using the Samsung
diagnostics to check for fakes). Both suppliers had two drives for sale, but I bought
one from each to reduce the risk of correlated problems in a RAID array.
Both had been heavily used, but still had more than 90% of their rated life left. I see
this as getting somebody else to do the burn-in testing for me!
One interesting issue that I came across was that one of the drives initially had a much
lower write speed than normal. It recovered after I had written data to all locations. I
think it must have been in a system without TRIM activated, so every write needed an
erase first.
John
Reply by Rich S●October 14, 20222022-10-14
On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 4:35:38 PM UTC, Ricky wrote:
> On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 11:50:00 AM UTC-4, boB wrote:
> > On Fri, 14 Oct 2022 06:21:02 -0700 (PDT), Ricky
> > <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > >On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 4:31:42 AM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
> > >> On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 11:27:13 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
> > >> > On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 1:46:06 AM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > > A good half-terabyte M.2 NVMe drive is about $50, and has four lanes (4x faster than USB-C). Add $20 for
> > >> > > a USB interface and case, if you want it external and portable. USB cable extra.
> > >> > I think you mean add nothing for the USB interface and $1 for the "case". This was a USB memory stick, not a hard drive replacement. But thanks for the $50 figure. In the meantime I've wiped an old drive that was storing stuff I don't need anymore.
> > >> I tried a microSD card with 1 TB for $10-ish, and a USB dock for it for about $1. The SD card, with the same
> > >> h2testw, actually got to day two of testing (about 300GB) before it faulted. It's not a mislabeled item, or complete fraud,
> > >> just a low-reliability card (this was Xiaomi brand, and less return-able than an Amazon purchase).
> > >
> > >It's pretty inconceivable that a 1TB drive could be sold for $10 unless it used defective chips (rejects). One way or the other, this is a fake part.
> > I got two of these supposedly 2 TB sticks. They were definitely
> > fake. I was stupid for even thinking you could get a 2TB stick for
> > under $75. I'm not sure you can even get one for $750 ??
> That's the problem. The quality is not related to the price. That's why I test all the flash devices I buy, regardless of price.
>
> --
>
> Rick C.
>
> ++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
> ++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
Ah OK so youre looking for intersection of
- 100% reliability,
- accurately-stated capacity,
- and low purchase price.
Those requirements tend to correlate with established brands
of product, and reputable vendors.
User reviews on a platform like Amazon, are poor indicators
of those factors. (research studies supports that).
Of course I respect your desire to "test the marketplace" and
challenge these things :-)
Reply by Ricky●October 14, 20222022-10-14
On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 11:50:00 AM UTC-4, boB wrote:
> On Fri, 14 Oct 2022 06:21:02 -0700 (PDT), Ricky
> <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 4:31:42 AM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
> >> On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 11:27:13 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
> >> > On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 1:46:06 AM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
> >>
> >> > > A good half-terabyte M.2 NVMe drive is about $50, and has four lanes (4x faster than USB-C). Add $20 for
> >> > > a USB interface and case, if you want it external and portable. USB cable extra.
> >> > I think you mean add nothing for the USB interface and $1 for the "case". This was a USB memory stick, not a hard drive replacement. But thanks for the $50 figure. In the meantime I've wiped an old drive that was storing stuff I don't need anymore.
> >> I tried a microSD card with 1 TB for $10-ish, and a USB dock for it for about $1. The SD card, with the same
> >> h2testw, actually got to day two of testing (about 300GB) before it faulted. It's not a mislabeled item, or complete fraud,
> >> just a low-reliability card (this was Xiaomi brand, and less return-able than an Amazon purchase).
> >
> >It's pretty inconceivable that a 1TB drive could be sold for $10 unless it used defective chips (rejects). One way or the other, this is a fake part.
> I got two of these supposedly 2 TB sticks. They were definitely
> fake. I was stupid for even thinking you could get a 2TB stick for
> under $75. I'm not sure you can even get one for $750 ??
That's the problem. The quality is not related to the price. That's why I test all the flash devices I buy, regardless of price.
--
Rick C.
++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
Reply by Martin Rid●October 14, 20222022-10-14
John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandSNIPMEtechnology.com> Wrote in message:r
> On Thu, 13 Oct 2022 21:48:02 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee<edward.ming.lee@gmail.com> wrote:>On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 9:42:21 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:>> I thought I would give Amazon a try and see if the USB flash drives sold there are any better than the crap sold on eBay. Well, it seems not. I picked a drive in a metal case to stand up to a bit of abuse and order two in order to get the free shipping. Amazon makes it hard to get the free shipping without signing up for their master plan that's over $100 a year now. But eventually I got that to work. >> >> So the drives came today and I plugged on in to be tested with H2testw. Of course it failed. It seems to be a 32 GB drive doctored to report 512 GB. >> >> The return process involves a QR code that you show to the UPS store, but they don't send it to the phone in a convenient manner. I would have had to use a SD card to move it or I guess I could email it to myself. So I tried calling Amazon to see if they could just email it to me. The person on the phone was a bit hard to understand, but eventually we communicated. In the end, after I asked for this vendor to be reported, she said she would do that and also gave me the refund without a return. >> >> So in the end it worked out, but Amazon doesn't make it easy. I guess if I were a high volume Amazon customer, I would know how to make it all easy, and would also be able to give this outfit a bad review. But I'm not allowed to write reviews until I've spent $50! >> >> So much for buying at Amazon. >>You didn't say how much you paid for them. But from guessing, it's 2x 512G for less than $50. You got what you paid for.Rick's life seems to be centered on cheap. He said his dad was likethat too. Could be hereditary.
On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 8:50:00 AM UTC-7, boB wrote:
> On Fri, 14 Oct 2022 06:21:02 -0700 (PDT), Ricky
> <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 4:31:42 AM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
> >> On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 11:27:13 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
> >> > On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 1:46:06 AM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
> >>
> >> > > A good half-terabyte M.2 NVMe drive is about $50, and has four lanes (4x faster than USB-C). Add $20 for
> >> > > a USB interface and case, if you want it external and portable. USB cable extra.
> >> > I think you mean add nothing for the USB interface and $1 for the "case". This was a USB memory stick, not a hard drive replacement. But thanks for the $50 figure. In the meantime I've wiped an old drive that was storing stuff I don't need anymore.
> >> I tried a microSD card with 1 TB for $10-ish, and a USB dock for it for about $1. The SD card, with the same
> >> h2testw, actually got to day two of testing (about 300GB) before it faulted. It's not a mislabeled item, or complete fraud,
> >> just a low-reliability card (this was Xiaomi brand, and less return-able than an Amazon purchase).
> >
> >It's pretty inconceivable that a 1TB drive could be sold for $10 unless it used defective chips (rejects). One way or the other, this is a fake part.
> I got two of these supposedly 2 TB sticks. They were definitely
> fake. I was stupid for even thinking you could get a 2TB stick for
> under $75. I'm not sure you can even get one for $750 ??
Real 1/2TB is around $50 to $100. 1TB $100 to $150. 2TB $150 to $200.
Of course, fakes and rejects from the "Land of Cheap Lies" are available for much less. $10 TB are as real as $1 9800mAhr 18650.
Reply by boB●October 14, 20222022-10-14
On Fri, 14 Oct 2022 06:21:02 -0700 (PDT), Ricky
<gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 4:31:42 AM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
>> On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 11:27:13 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
>> > On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 1:46:06 AM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
>>
>> > > A good half-terabyte M.2 NVMe drive is about $50, and has four lanes (4x faster than USB-C). Add $20 for
>> > > a USB interface and case, if you want it external and portable. USB cable extra.
>> > I think you mean add nothing for the USB interface and $1 for the "case". This was a USB memory stick, not a hard drive replacement. But thanks for the $50 figure. In the meantime I've wiped an old drive that was storing stuff I don't need anymore.
>> I tried a microSD card with 1 TB for $10-ish, and a USB dock for it for about $1. The SD card, with the same
>> h2testw, actually got to day two of testing (about 300GB) before it faulted. It's not a mislabeled item, or complete fraud,
>> just a low-reliability card (this was Xiaomi brand, and less return-able than an Amazon purchase).
>
>It's pretty inconceivable that a 1TB drive could be sold for $10 unless it used defective chips (rejects). One way or the other, this is a fake part.
I got two of these supposedly 2 TB sticks. They were definitely
fake. I was stupid for even thinking you could get a 2TB stick for
under $75. I'm not sure you can even get one for $750 ??
boB
>
>
>> For some applications, it might even be useful.
>
>If you have absolutely no concern about it continuing to work or store data. I suppose there are uses where it only needs to store data for a short time.
>
>
>> The M.2 drives, though, are price and performance winners; a fast USB interface is less mass-producible than
>> the card edge M.2 NVMe form factor. NVMe needs case, power regulator, and controller interface to talk USB.
>
>Unfortunately, no matter how good a NVMe interface is, it won't fit a USB socket.
Reply by John Larkin●October 14, 20222022-10-14
On Thu, 13 Oct 2022 21:48:02 -0700 (PDT), Ed Lee
<edward.ming.lee@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 9:42:21 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
>> I thought I would give Amazon a try and see if the USB flash drives sold there are any better than the crap sold on eBay. Well, it seems not. I picked a drive in a metal case to stand up to a bit of abuse and order two in order to get the free shipping. Amazon makes it hard to get the free shipping without signing up for their master plan that's over $100 a year now. But eventually I got that to work.
>>
>> So the drives came today and I plugged on in to be tested with H2testw. Of course it failed. It seems to be a 32 GB drive doctored to report 512 GB.
>>
>> The return process involves a QR code that you show to the UPS store, but they don't send it to the phone in a convenient manner. I would have had to use a SD card to move it or I guess I could email it to myself. So I tried calling Amazon to see if they could just email it to me. The person on the phone was a bit hard to understand, but eventually we communicated. In the end, after I asked for this vendor to be reported, she said she would do that and also gave me the refund without a return.
>>
>> So in the end it worked out, but Amazon doesn't make it easy. I guess if I were a high volume Amazon customer, I would know how to make it all easy, and would also be able to give this outfit a bad review. But I'm not allowed to write reviews until I've spent $50!
>>
>> So much for buying at Amazon.
>
>You didn't say how much you paid for them. But from guessing, it's 2x 512G for less than $50. You got what you paid for.
Rick's life seems to be centered on cheap. He said his dad was like
that too. Could be hereditary.
Reply by Ricky●October 14, 20222022-10-14
On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 9:35:05 AM UTC-4, Rich S wrote:
> On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 5:19:35 AM UTC, Ricky wrote:
> > On Friday, October 14, 2022 at 12:48:06 AM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
> > > On Thursday, October 13, 2022 at 9:42:21 PM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
> > > > I thought I would give Amazon a try and see if the USB flash drives sold there are any better than the crap sold on eBay. Well, it seems not. I picked a drive in a metal case to stand up to a bit of abuse and order two in order to get the free shipping. Amazon makes it hard to get the free shipping without signing up for their master plan that's over $100 a year now. But eventually I got that to work.
> > > >
> > > > So the drives came today and I plugged on in to be tested with H2testw. Of course it failed. It seems to be a 32 GB drive doctored to report 512 GB.
> > > >
> > > > The return process involves a QR code that you show to the UPS store, but they don't send it to the phone in a convenient manner. I would have had to use a SD card to move it or I guess I could email it to myself. So I tried calling Amazon to see if they could just email it to me. The person on the phone was a bit hard to understand, but eventually we communicated. In the end, after I asked for this vendor to be reported, she said she would do that and also gave me the refund without a return.
> > > >
> > > > So in the end it worked out, but Amazon doesn't make it easy. I guess if I were a high volume Amazon customer, I would know how to make it all easy, and would also be able to give this outfit a bad review. But I'm not allowed to write reviews until I've spent $50!
> > > >
> > > > So much for buying at Amazon.
> > > You didn't say how much you paid for them. But from guessing, it's 2x 512G for less than $50. You got what you paid for.
> > In the end I paid nothing. What should these drives cost?
> >
> > --
> >
> > Rick C.
> >
> > + Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
> > + Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
> well your time spent is worth money, eh, Rick?
> Losing an hour of your time could easily out-cost
> those purchases :-)
>
> I try to use "name brand" product. And ignore
> user reviews.
How do you know these were not name brand? The counterfeiters mark up the capacity of flash drives. They do that with any brand. If there were a break point with lots of options at or above and few below, I would say those below are counterfeit. But there's no longer a discernible break point. Unless you know the "fair" price of a flash drive, you have nothing to go on.
I've never tested the waters extensively, but it's possible they know no shame and sell the counterfeits at the "fair" price as well.
--
Rick C.
+- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
+- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209