Reply by bitrex January 10, 20162016-01-10
Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> Wrote in message:
> On 01/10/2016 01:14 PM, bitrex wrote: >> Rob <nomail@example.com> Wrote in message: >>> bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> wrote: >>>> I think my first real PC was around 1991 - it was a 386SX at >>>> 16MHz. It originally came with a meg of RAM, and I installed a >>>> second meg at some point (that really hurt my pockets!) I think >>>> two was the max the mobo supported. I don't think I ever invested >>>> in the FPU coprocessor option. 44 megabyte hard drive. >>>> >>>> It ran Sim Earth, Shuttle Simulator, and Wolfenstein 3D really >>>> well. Sometimes I had to mess with the HIMEM settings and such to >>>> free up enough extended memory for certain programs to >>>> run. >>>> >>>> Unfortunately, I couldn't run Doom, as it needed a minimum of 4 >>>> megs to work. And the 16MHz 386 likely wasn't gutsy enough to run >>>> it at any decent resolution, even though the code was written >>>> with PCs that didn't have FPUs in mind. 386s with more ram and a >>>> 40 Mhz clock can pull it off IIRC. >>>> >>>> The fast inverse sqrt algorithm used in the follow up game to >>>> compute dot products between lighting vectors and surface normals >>>> is pretty cool. >>> >>> Ok... but I did not want to invest money in a system that would not be >>> able to run a real OS. I already had an Atari ST since 1985 and it was >>> similarly speced like the above, but like a DOS machine it was not >>> really suitable for multitasking, networking, etc. >>> >>> Linux changed all that. Before it would be possible to run XENIX >>> or SCO UNIX on 386/486 hardware, but the OS and tools alone would cost >>> a similar amount to what I spent on the hardware. And Linux was (and >>> is) free. >>> >> >> Consumer Linux really has come a long way. I have a Celeron >> netbook - running win 8.1 on it is painful, but Xubuntu flies and >> is a pleasure. It makes it into like, an actual useful >> computer. >> >> I run Windows 7 on my desktop (actually a rackmount) because there >> are some audio production applications I need that simply will >> not run under WINE. That one is a 4 core AMD of some variety. >> >> >> I'd like to dual boot Ubuntu on that one, but the main disk is >> RAID0 and I've been having a lot of trouble setting up GRUB and >> the MBR etc. properly to make it work. >> > > Given our current environment, I commend to your attention the Qubes OS, > http://qubes-os.org. Nation-state capabilities such as firmware attacks > on USB and hard drives have leaked into the criminal sector, so you > don't have to be a dissident/whistleblower/traitor/criminal to need that > sort of protection. > > Cheers > > Phil Hobbs >
You don't have to be a dissident, but it sure helps. -- ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/
Reply by Phil Hobbs January 10, 20162016-01-10
On 01/10/2016 01:14 PM, bitrex wrote:
> Rob <nomail@example.com> Wrote in message: >> bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> wrote: >>> I think my first real PC was around 1991 - it was a 386SX at >>> 16MHz. It originally came with a meg of RAM, and I installed a >>> second meg at some point (that really hurt my pockets!) I think >>> two was the max the mobo supported. I don't think I ever invested >>> in the FPU coprocessor option. 44 megabyte hard drive. >>> >>> It ran Sim Earth, Shuttle Simulator, and Wolfenstein 3D really >>> well. Sometimes I had to mess with the HIMEM settings and such to >>> free up enough extended memory for certain programs to >>> run. >>> >>> Unfortunately, I couldn't run Doom, as it needed a minimum of 4 >>> megs to work. And the 16MHz 386 likely wasn't gutsy enough to run >>> it at any decent resolution, even though the code was written >>> with PCs that didn't have FPUs in mind. 386s with more ram and a >>> 40 Mhz clock can pull it off IIRC. >>> >>> The fast inverse sqrt algorithm used in the follow up game to >>> compute dot products between lighting vectors and surface normals >>> is pretty cool. >> >> Ok... but I did not want to invest money in a system that would not be >> able to run a real OS. I already had an Atari ST since 1985 and it was >> similarly speced like the above, but like a DOS machine it was not >> really suitable for multitasking, networking, etc. >> >> Linux changed all that. Before it would be possible to run XENIX >> or SCO UNIX on 386/486 hardware, but the OS and tools alone would cost >> a similar amount to what I spent on the hardware. And Linux was (and >> is) free. >> > > Consumer Linux really has come a long way. I have a Celeron > netbook - running win 8.1 on it is painful, but Xubuntu flies and > is a pleasure. It makes it into like, an actual useful > computer. > > I run Windows 7 on my desktop (actually a rackmount) because there > are some audio production applications I need that simply will > not run under WINE. That one is a 4 core AMD of some variety. > > > I'd like to dual boot Ubuntu on that one, but the main disk is > RAID0 and I've been having a lot of trouble setting up GRUB and > the MBR etc. properly to make it work. >
Given our current environment, I commend to your attention the Qubes OS, http://qubes-os.org. Nation-state capabilities such as firmware attacks on USB and hard drives have leaked into the criminal sector, so you don't have to be a dissident/whistleblower/traitor/criminal to need that sort of protection. Cheers Phil Hobbs
Reply by bitrex January 10, 20162016-01-10
Rob <nomail@example.com> Wrote in message:
> bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> wrote: >> I think my first real PC was around 1991 - it was a 386SX at >> 16MHz. It originally came with a meg of RAM, and I installed a >> second meg at some point (that really hurt my pockets!) I think >> two was the max the mobo supported. I don't think I ever invested >> in the FPU coprocessor option. 44 megabyte hard drive. >> >> It ran Sim Earth, Shuttle Simulator, and Wolfenstein 3D really >> well. Sometimes I had to mess with the HIMEM settings and such to >> free up enough extended memory for certain programs to >> run. >> >> Unfortunately, I couldn't run Doom, as it needed a minimum of 4 >> megs to work. And the 16MHz 386 likely wasn't gutsy enough to run >> it at any decent resolution, even though the code was written >> with PCs that didn't have FPUs in mind. 386s with more ram and a >> 40 Mhz clock can pull it off IIRC. >> >> The fast inverse sqrt algorithm used in the follow up game to >> compute dot products between lighting vectors and surface normals >> is pretty cool. > > Ok... but I did not want to invest money in a system that would not be > able to run a real OS. I already had an Atari ST since 1985 and it was > similarly speced like the above, but like a DOS machine it was not > really suitable for multitasking, networking, etc. > > Linux changed all that. Before it would be possible to run XENIX > or SCO UNIX on 386/486 hardware, but the OS and tools alone would cost > a similar amount to what I spent on the hardware. And Linux was (and > is) free. >
Consumer Linux really has come a long way. I have a Celeron netbook - running win 8.1 on it is painful, but Xubuntu flies and is a pleasure. It makes it into like, an actual useful computer. I run Windows 7 on my desktop (actually a rackmount) because there are some audio production applications I need that simply will not run under WINE. That one is a 4 core AMD of some variety. I'd like to dual boot Ubuntu on that one, but the main disk is RAID0 and I've been having a lot of trouble setting up GRUB and the MBR etc. properly to make it work. -- ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/
Reply by Rob January 10, 20162016-01-10
bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> wrote:
> I think my first real PC was around 1991 - it was a 386SX at > 16MHz. It originally came with a meg of RAM, and I installed a > second meg at some point (that really hurt my pockets!) I think > two was the max the mobo supported. I don't think I ever invested > in the FPU coprocessor option. 44 megabyte hard drive. > > It ran Sim Earth, Shuttle Simulator, and Wolfenstein 3D really > well. Sometimes I had to mess with the HIMEM settings and such to > free up enough extended memory for certain programs to > run. > > Unfortunately, I couldn't run Doom, as it needed a minimum of 4 > megs to work. And the 16MHz 386 likely wasn't gutsy enough to run > it at any decent resolution, even though the code was written > with PCs that didn't have FPUs in mind. 386s with more ram and a > 40 Mhz clock can pull it off IIRC. > > The fast inverse sqrt algorithm used in the follow up game to > compute dot products between lighting vectors and surface normals > is pretty cool.
Ok... but I did not want to invest money in a system that would not be able to run a real OS. I already had an Atari ST since 1985 and it was similarly speced like the above, but like a DOS machine it was not really suitable for multitasking, networking, etc. Linux changed all that. Before it would be possible to run XENIX or SCO UNIX on 386/486 hardware, but the OS and tools alone would cost a similar amount to what I spent on the hardware. And Linux was (and is) free.
Reply by bitrex January 10, 20162016-01-10
Rob <nomail@example.com> Wrote in message:
> bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> wrote: >> Rob <nomail@example.com> Wrote in message: >>> bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> wrote: >>>> 8 channels of 24 bit 192 kHz for under $5 in small quantities - we >>>> really have come a long way since I got my first PC and a Sound >>>> Blaster audio card back in 1994... >>> >>> I had a Gravis Ultrasound (classic) card in late 1992, quite expensive >>> hardware solution to offload wavetable based synthesis from the central >>> processor. It could almost play MIDI files by itself. >>> >> >> Nice! I was around 15 at that time and couldn't afford such >> luxury. IIRC the SB Pro could stream PCM audio (don't know if it >> was CD quality); it could also play MIDI files but I think the >> output was limited to 8 channels and synthesiszed by some Yamaha >> 4 operator FM synthesizer IC. It was pretty bad. To get decent >> sounding audio you had to use something called a "mod tracker" >> which used small samples streamed from main memory. > > The Gravis Ultrasound had onboard memory where the samples were stored > by the driver, and a dedicated chip that counted through the samples > at the specified rate (32 channels I believe) and sent the output > through a D/A. > > It was good at that, but not at outputting generic digital data from > e.g. an MP3 decoder. However, in those days that was not really > available anyway. > > I assembled that system from a mix of surplus and new components obtained > on a computer fair, it was a 486DX/33 with 16MB RAM, Adaptec 1542B busmaster > SCSI controller, 800MB SCSI harddisk with 2.5 MB/s transfer rate, 250MB > tape streamer, the Gravis Ultrasound, 10 Mbit network card, an ET4000 video > controller, and I had a 17" VGA monitor, keyboard and mouse. > All this set me back about the equivalent of $4000. > > However, it ran Linux! (0.96 kernel) > With X window system. This was quite something to have at home in those > days, the performance and capability was comparable to workstations one > would normally have only at work. And a true 32-bit OS with demand paged > virtual memory. > > Remember Windows back then was a DOS program... and the big next thing > was OS/2 which was only 16-bit segmented 286 code. >
I think my first real PC was around 1991 - it was a 386SX at 16MHz. It originally came with a meg of RAM, and I installed a second meg at some point (that really hurt my pockets!) I think two was the max the mobo supported. I don't think I ever invested in the FPU coprocessor option. 44 megabyte hard drive. It ran Sim Earth, Shuttle Simulator, and Wolfenstein 3D really well. Sometimes I had to mess with the HIMEM settings and such to free up enough extended memory for certain programs to run. Unfortunately, I couldn't run Doom, as it needed a minimum of 4 megs to work. And the 16MHz 386 likely wasn't gutsy enough to run it at any decent resolution, even though the code was written with PCs that didn't have FPUs in mind. 386s with more ram and a 40 Mhz clock can pull it off IIRC. The fast inverse sqrt algorithm used in the follow up game to compute dot products between lighting vectors and surface normals is pretty cool. -- ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/
Reply by Habib Bouaziz-Viallet January 8, 20162016-01-08
On 08/01/2016 05:55, rickman wrote:
> > AKM is another vendor with decent audio chips.
Agreed. AKM audio chips are just EXTRAORDINARY ! Hab.
Reply by Rob January 8, 20162016-01-08
bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> wrote:
> Rob <nomail@example.com> Wrote in message: >> bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> wrote: >>> 8 channels of 24 bit 192 kHz for under $5 in small quantities - we >>> really have come a long way since I got my first PC and a Sound >>> Blaster audio card back in 1994... >> >> I had a Gravis Ultrasound (classic) card in late 1992, quite expensive >> hardware solution to offload wavetable based synthesis from the central >> processor. It could almost play MIDI files by itself. >> > > Nice! I was around 15 at that time and couldn't afford such > luxury. IIRC the SB Pro could stream PCM audio (don't know if it > was CD quality); it could also play MIDI files but I think the > output was limited to 8 channels and synthesiszed by some Yamaha > 4 operator FM synthesizer IC. It was pretty bad. To get decent > sounding audio you had to use something called a "mod tracker" > which used small samples streamed from main memory.
The Gravis Ultrasound had onboard memory where the samples were stored by the driver, and a dedicated chip that counted through the samples at the specified rate (32 channels I believe) and sent the output through a D/A. It was good at that, but not at outputting generic digital data from e.g. an MP3 decoder. However, in those days that was not really available anyway. I assembled that system from a mix of surplus and new components obtained on a computer fair, it was a 486DX/33 with 16MB RAM, Adaptec 1542B busmaster SCSI controller, 800MB SCSI harddisk with 2.5 MB/s transfer rate, 250MB tape streamer, the Gravis Ultrasound, 10 Mbit network card, an ET4000 video controller, and I had a 17" VGA monitor, keyboard and mouse. All this set me back about the equivalent of $4000. However, it ran Linux! (0.96 kernel) With X window system. This was quite something to have at home in those days, the performance and capability was comparable to workstations one would normally have only at work. And a true 32-bit OS with demand paged virtual memory. Remember Windows back then was a DOS program... and the big next thing was OS/2 which was only 16-bit segmented 286 code.
Reply by bitrex January 8, 20162016-01-08
Rob <nomail@example.com> Wrote in message:
> bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> wrote: >> 8 channels of 24 bit 192 kHz for under $5 in small quantities - we >> really have come a long way since I got my first PC and a Sound >> Blaster audio card back in 1994... > > I had a Gravis Ultrasound (classic) card in late 1992, quite expensive > hardware solution to offload wavetable based synthesis from the central > processor. It could almost play MIDI files by itself. >
Nice! I was around 15 at that time and couldn't afford such luxury. IIRC the SB Pro could stream PCM audio (don't know if it was CD quality); it could also play MIDI files but I think the output was limited to 8 channels and synthesiszed by some Yamaha 4 operator FM synthesizer IC. It was pretty bad. To get decent sounding audio you had to use something called a "mod tracker" which used small samples streamed from main memory. It could do text to speech as well, there was a DOS program that was an ELIZA variant called DR. SBAITZO which would speak its responses. Good for hours of fun. Around that time I also had a Yamaha portable keyboard called the VSS-30 which could record short samples. It had a line out which I patched into the phone, and used the pitch shift to prank call my friends with a "demon voice". -- ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/
Reply by Rob January 8, 20162016-01-08
bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> wrote:
> 8 channels of 24 bit 192 kHz for under $5 in small quantities - we > really have come a long way since I got my first PC and a Sound > Blaster audio card back in 1994...
I had a Gravis Ultrasound (classic) card in late 1992, quite expensive hardware solution to offload wavetable based synthesis from the central processor. It could almost play MIDI files by itself.
Reply by bitrex January 8, 20162016-01-08
krw <krw@nowhere.com> Wrote in message:
> On Thu, 7 Jan 2016 22:53:45 -0500 (EST), bitrex > <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> wrote: > >> >>I'd like to drive 6 channels of 16 bit, 44.1 kHz audio out of an >> ARM Cortex M4 processor, using i2c I guess. > > I2C isn't going to cut it. You're going to want to use some variant > of I2S (probably TDM-8). Atmel ARMs have two (one in, one out) I2S > ports. >> >>There are so many DACS out there...so this is another one of those >> "so what is cheap and worked good for you" kind of >> questions. > > I use the Cirrus Logic CS4385A. It's 8-channel but you can just throw > two away. It's the cheapest DAC I've been able to find and it's > pretty good. Differential outputs (which I like), though. >
8 channels of 24 bit 192 kHz for under $5 in small quantities - we really have come a long way since I got my first PC and a Sound Blaster audio card back in 1994... -- ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/