Author: Michael A. TerrellDate: 03:39 23-08-06
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BobG wrote:
>
> Michael A. Terrell wrote:
> > Sure I can, with an oscilloscope.
> =================================
> Nah. If its digital, and I give you one measurement, you get a dot. If
> its analog, and I give you one sweep, an instantaneous measurement is
> any height of the trace from zero to the trace. So you could measure
> the positive or negative peak at that instant, and hope or guess that
> the other peak would be symmetrical, but you've lost the bet because it
> would take you two measurements at two instants in time to measure two
> peak voltages. I win.
Ok, you win. The Booby prize. Enjoy your word games and make sure
that you keep showing your ignorance.
--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.
Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
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Author: jasenDate: 03:52 23-08-06
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On 2006-08-22, BobG <bobgardner@aol.com> wrote:
> Eeyore wrote:
>> Yes there is.
>===========================
> I bet you can't measure it instantaneously.
you can't measure RMS instantaneously either.
Bye.
Jasen
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Author: EeyoreDate: 08:29 23-08-06
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jasen wrote:
> On 2006-08-22, BobG <bobgardner@aol.com> wrote:
> > Eeyore wrote:
> >> Yes there is.
> >===========================
> > I bet you can't measure it instantaneously.
>
> you can't measure RMS instantaneously either.
If you know the frequency, the simultaneous measurement of V and dV/dt will give
you the answer.
Graham
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Author: BobGDate: 08:37 23-08-06
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Phil Allison wrote:
> "BobG" = a complete fool demonstrating his MASSIVE ignorance.
> ** Fuck off - ASD freak.
=====================================
What's ASD mean? Is that some Strine slang like 'Gday'? Oh... sorry, Mr
Phil would never utter the words 'Good Day'. As for MASSIVE ignorance,
we all seem to have our strong and weak points. One of your strongest
points seems to be your uncanny ability to belch up an epithet at
anyone that you perceive to have any difference of opinion from you on
any subject, political, electronics, religious. Do you have the
complete Quaran memorized word for word? That would be the obsessive
compulsive behaviour I would expect from you. I bet you were the top of
your class in the Mullah's Islamic school of love and tolerance. I
love you brother Phil.
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Author: Tim AutonDate: 08:58 23-08-06
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Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations@REMOVETHIS.hotmail.com> wrote:
> jasen wrote:
> > On 2006-08-22, BobG <bobgardner@aol.com> wrote:
> > > Eeyore wrote:
> > >> Yes there is.
> > >===========================
> > > I bet you can't measure it instantaneously.
> >
> > you can't measure RMS instantaneously either.
>
> If you know the frequency, the simultaneous measurement of V and dV/dt
> will give you the answer.
This is a bloody stupid argument anyway; being able to measure something
instantaneously is wholly irrelevant. But...
How would you expect to measure dV/dt with a single sample?
Tim
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Author: Phil AllisonDate: 10:28 23-08-06
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"Tim Auton"
> How would you expect to measure dV/dt with a single sample?
** So long as the wave is sine shaped, the dV/dt wave is also sine shaped.
When the original wave peaks, dV/dt goes through zero & when the original
wave goes through zero, the dV /dt wave peaks. An RC network ( ie 6dB /oct
HPF) can easily be designed to derive the matching dV /dt wave in *real
time* for a input wave with known characteristics.
A steady sine wave voltage of given frequency has a unique dV/dt at any
point in time - so it follows that if both V and dV/dt are known for a
point in time, so is the steady voltage.
....... Phil
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Author: Greg HansenDate: 10:45 23-08-06
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jasen wrote:
> On 2006-08-22, BobG <bobgardner@aol.com> wrote:
>
>>Eeyore wrote:
>>
>>>Yes there is.
>>
>>===========================
>>I bet you can't measure it instantaneously.
>
>
> you can't measure RMS instantaneously either.
>
> Bye.
> Jasen
Or even DC, really. Not without allowing some settling time for the
needle or the ADC.
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Author: jasenDate: 03:01 24-08-06
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On 2006-08-23, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelations@REMOVETHIS.hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> jasen wrote:
>
>> On 2006-08-22, BobG <bobgardner@aol.com> wrote:
>> > Eeyore wrote:
>> >> Yes there is.
>> >===========================
>> > I bet you can't measure it instantaneously.
>>
>> you can't measure RMS instantaneously either.
>
> If you know the frequency, the simultaneous measurement of V and dV/dt will give
> you the answer.
try that on a staircase,
--
Bye.
Jasen
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Author: Phil AllisonDate: 07:06 24-08-06
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"jasen" <jasen@free.net.nz>
> try that on a staircase,
** Try hurling yourself down one -
you PITA,
dead sheep shagging,
ASD fucked,
Kiwi BLOODY IDIOT !!!
........ Phil
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Author: Alan BDate: 23:32 26-08-06
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On 23 Aug 2006 07:52:24 GMT, in message <ech1fo$vkh$2@gonzo.homenet>, jasen
<jasen@free.net.nz> scribed:
>On 2006-08-22, BobG <bobgardner@aol.com> wrote:
>> Eeyore wrote:
>>> Yes there is.
>>===========================
>> I bet you can't measure it instantaneously.
>
>you can't measure RMS instantaneously either.
Precluded by the "Mean" part of the term, wouldn't you say?
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Author: John LarkinDate: 13:31 27-08-06
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On 23 Aug 2006 07:52:24 GMT, jasen <jasen@free.net.nz> wrote:
>On 2006-08-22, BobG <bobgardner@aol.com> wrote:
>> Eeyore wrote:
>>> Yes there is.
>>===========================
>> I bet you can't measure it instantaneously.
>
>you can't measure RMS instantaneously either.
>
>Bye.
> Jasen
I can easily calculate the RMS value of a single, instantaneous
voltage measurement. Very easily.
John
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Author: BobGDate: 17:34 27-08-06
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John Larkin wrote:
> I can easily calculate the RMS value of a single, instantaneous
> voltage measurement. Very easily.
===============================
OK, you've got my attention. Just don't make Phil cuss me out anymore.
I can't take it. I'm an only child. Very sensitive.
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Author: EeyoreDate: 17:52 27-08-06
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BobG wrote:
> John Larkin wrote:
> > I can easily calculate the RMS value of a single, instantaneous
> > voltage measurement. Very easily.
> ===============================
> OK, you've got my attention. Just don't make Phil cuss me out anymore.
> I can't take it. I'm an only child. Very sensitive.
You need to know f first.
An 'instantaneous' measurement of V and dV/dt will tell you all you need to know
about the magnitude of a sinusoidal waveform.
I don't understand how JL can do it with a single measurement unless he knows
the phase angle too.
Graham
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Author: John FieldsDate: 18:58 27-08-06
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On Sun, 27 Aug 2006 22:52:43 +0100, Eeyore
<rabbitsfriendsandrelations@REMOVETHIS.hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>BobG wrote:
>
>> John Larkin wrote:
>> > I can easily calculate the RMS value of a single, instantaneous
>> > voltage measurement. Very easily.
>> ===============================
>> OK, you've got my attention. Just don't make Phil cuss me out anymore.
>> I can't take it. I'm an only child. Very sensitive.
>
>You need to know f first.
>
>An 'instantaneous' measurement of V and dV/dt will tell you all you need to know
>about the magnitude of a sinusoidal waveform.
>
>I don't understand how JL can do it with a single measurement unless he knows
>the phase angle too.
---
He can't.
No matter what, at least two measurements will have to be made,
which blows Larkin's hypothesis out of the water.
>
--
John Fields
Professional Circuit Designer
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Author: Tim AutonDate: 19:00 27-08-06
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BobG <bobgardner@aol.com> wrote:
> John Larkin wrote:
> > I can easily calculate the RMS value of a single, instantaneous
> > voltage measurement. Very easily.
> ===============================
> OK, you've got my attention. Just don't make Phil cuss me out anymore.
> I can't take it. I'm an only child. Very sensitive.
The RMS value of a *single* voltage measurement...
Tim
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Author: John FieldsDate: 19:30 27-08-06
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On Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:00:12 +0100,
tim.auton@uton.groupSexWithoutTheY (Tim Auton) wrote:
>BobG <bobgardner@aol.com> wrote:
>> John Larkin wrote:
>> > I can easily calculate the RMS value of a single, instantaneous
>> > voltage measurement. Very easily.
>> ===============================
>> OK, you've got my attention. Just don't make Phil cuss me out anymore.
>> I can't take it. I'm an only child. Very sensitive.
>
>The RMS value of a *single* voltage measurement...
---
That depends on knowing the shape of the waveform before the
measurement is made.
Sinusoid? One answer.
Square wave? A different answer.
In any case, Larkin, if you don't know the waveshape of the incoming
signal and you have to wait until you can figure out what it is,
your claim that you can calculate the "RMS value of a single,
instantaneous voltage measurement" is specious.
--
John Fields
Professional Circuit Designer
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Author: Tim AutonDate: 20:25 27-08-06
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John Fields <jfields@austininstruments.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:00:12 +0100,
> tim.auton@uton.groupSexWithoutTheY (Tim Auton) wrote:
> >BobG <bobgardner@aol.com> wrote:
> >> John Larkin wrote:
> >> > I can easily calculate the RMS value of a single, instantaneous
> >> > voltage measurement. Very easily.
> >> ===============================
> >> OK, you've got my attention. Just don't make Phil cuss me out anymore.
> >> I can't take it. I'm an only child. Very sensitive.
> >
> >The RMS value of a *single* voltage measurement...
>
> That depends on knowing the shape of the waveform before the
> measurement is made.
This thread descended into pedantry a little while ago, in case you
hadn't noticed :)
Read carefully. John never said he could measure the RMS value of an
arbitrary waveform from a single voltage measurement.
Tim
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Author: BobGDate: 23:10 27-08-06
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Tim Auton wrote:
> This thread descended into pedantry a little while ago, in case you
> hadn't noticed :)
==========================================
I was hoping I'd get a little backup from some mathematician when I
said since the voltage was a function of time, it only had one value at
any instant in time, and thus my assertion that 'peak to peak' was not
a mathematical quantity like a vector or scalar etc etc. But
noooooo.... just jump all over the poor programmer........ tough bunch.
I'm just waiting for old Phil to slip up.....
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Author: Phil AllisonDate: 23:39 27-08-06
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"BobG" = Groper from Hell
( snip nauseating SHIT from this anencephalic)
** FUCK OFF !!
you ASD fucked TROLL !!!!
....... Phil
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Author: BobGDate: 00:15 28-08-06
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Phil Allison wrote:
> "BobG" = Groper from Hell
> ( snip nauseating SHIT from this anencephalic)
> ** FUCK OFF !!
> you ASD fucked TROLL !!!!
===========================================
Any Aussies care to step up to your buddy here and explain his 'Strine
to me? Is a Groper Someone Who Gropes? Like a dirty old man that cusses
a lot? Down at the end of this thread I asked him what he meant by ASD,
but I though I had given him such a dressing down that he was too
shamed to respond. Silly me. As for being a Troll, you think I actually
TRIED to get a rise out of you just for fun? I guess I'm just a troll
and you Phil are some sort of Grand PooBah of electronics. Funny Hat
and everything. Now don't forget your pills before you go to bed! You
get very grumpy!
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