Author: Eric R SnowDate: 14:10 19-12-06
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Greetungs All,
I have a small generator (700 watt, 850 surge) that I use to keep the
fridge running when the power is out. It is a robust unit made by
Robin and is at least 20 years old. It has an accurate analog
voltmeter on it. I tested it by comparing to a digital meter and by
directly connecting just the meter to the 115 volt, 60 Hz mains. The
label says that the generator puts out 60 Hz but when checked with an
oscilloscope (TEK 465B) it shows about 50 Hz. Even though the fridge
seems to run fine it sounds different than when operating from the
mains. The meter on it shows the voltage as being 115 volts and the
motor is running at the nameplate RPM. So what could be the reason for
the 'scope showing the lower Hz and is there anything I can do about
it? This generator uses brushes on a slip ring to energize the field
winding and has some type of transistorised voltage regulator.
Thanks,
Eric R Snow
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Author: Rich GriseDate: 17:55 19-12-06
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On Tue, 19 Dec 2006 11:10:25 -0800, Eric R Snow wrote:
> Greetungs All,
> I have a small generator (700 watt, 850 surge) that I use to keep the
> fridge running when the power is out. It is a robust unit made by
> Robin and is at least 20 years old. It has an accurate analog
> voltmeter on it. I tested it by comparing to a digital meter and by
> directly connecting just the meter to the 115 volt, 60 Hz mains. The
> label says that the generator puts out 60 Hz but when checked with an
> oscilloscope (TEK 465B) it shows about 50 Hz. Even though the fridge
> seems to run fine it sounds different than when operating from the
> mains. The meter on it shows the voltage as being 115 volts and the
> motor is running at the nameplate RPM. So what could be the reason for
> the 'scope showing the lower Hz and is there anything I can do about
> it? This generator uses brushes on a slip ring to energize the field
> winding and has some type of transistorised voltage regulator.
It might have come from Europe or something - doesn't it have a nameplate
that tells you what the output freq. is _supposed_ to be?
It might be as simple as an RPM adjust, since the voltage is regulated,
but anyone here would need much more information about the unit itself;
otherwise we'd just be guessing.
Thanks,
Rich
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Author: Don YoungDate: 22:36 19-12-06
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"Eric R Snow" <etpm@whidbey.com> wrote in message
news:kidgo2thapdvh1p0f8vqr3b32pjvf1rolt@4ax.com...
> Greetungs All,
> I have a small generator (700 watt, 850 surge) that I use to keep the
> fridge running when the power is out. It is a robust unit made by
> Robin and is at least 20 years old. It has an accurate analog
> voltmeter on it. I tested it by comparing to a digital meter and by
> directly connecting just the meter to the 115 volt, 60 Hz mains. The
> label says that the generator puts out 60 Hz but when checked with an
> oscilloscope (TEK 465B) it shows about 50 Hz. Even though the fridge
> seems to run fine it sounds different than when operating from the
> mains. The meter on it shows the voltage as being 115 volts and the
> motor is running at the nameplate RPM. So what could be the reason for
> the 'scope showing the lower Hz and is there anything I can do about
> it? This generator uses brushes on a slip ring to energize the field
> winding and has some type of transistorised voltage regulator.
> Thanks,
> Eric R Snow
Small generators generally need to be adjusted so that the voltage and
frequency are about 5 to 10 percent high with no load. Both will drop under
load. I would try setting the engine speed up a bit. I would also suspect
the oscilloscope calibration. The frequency cannot be incorrect when the
engine speed is correct if it is a direct connected generator.
Don Young
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Author: Phil AllisonDate: 01:54 20-12-06
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"Eric OR Snow"
>
> I have a small generator (700 watt, 850 surge) that I use to keep the
> fridge running when the power is out. It is a robust unit made by
> Robin and is at least 20 years old. It has an accurate analog
> voltmeter on it. I tested it by comparing to a digital meter and by
> directly connecting just the meter to the 115 volt, 60 Hz mains. The
> label says that the generator puts out 60 Hz but when checked with an
> oscilloscope (TEK 465B) it shows about 50 Hz.
** Test it with an electric clock or clock radio.
See how much time the clock loses over a few minutes.
....... Phil
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Author: James BeckDate: 10:22 20-12-06
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In article <4us519F19j3n3U1@mid.individual.net>, philallison@tpg.com.au
says...
>
> "Eric OR Snow"
> >
>
> > I have a small generator (700 watt, 850 surge) that I use to keep the
> > fridge running when the power is out. It is a robust unit made by
> > Robin and is at least 20 years old. It has an accurate analog
> > voltmeter on it. I tested it by comparing to a digital meter and by
> > directly connecting just the meter to the 115 volt, 60 Hz mains. The
> > label says that the generator puts out 60 Hz but when checked with an
> > oscilloscope (TEK 465B) it shows about 50 Hz.
>
>
> ** Test it with an electric clock or clock radio.
>
> See how much time the clock loses over a few minutes.
>
What would that accomplish above and beyond looking at the signal with
an O'scope? I would think the scope would be the preferred method and
the clock using the 60Hz as a timbase would be the "I a'int got no
scope" option. If his O'scope showed about 50Hz I would think it is
about 50Hz.
Jim
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Author: Peter BennettDate: 11:18 20-12-06
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On Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:36:59 -0600, "Don Young" <notme@nonesuch.com>
wrote:
>
>"Eric R Snow" <etpm@whidbey.com> wrote in message
>news:kidgo2thapdvh1p0f8vqr3b32pjvf1rolt@4ax.com...
>> Greetungs All,
>> I have a small generator (700 watt, 850 surge) that I use to keep the
>> fridge running when the power is out. It is a robust unit made by
>> Robin and is at least 20 years old. It has an accurate analog
>> voltmeter on it. I tested it by comparing to a digital meter and by
>> directly connecting just the meter to the 115 volt, 60 Hz mains. The
>> label says that the generator puts out 60 Hz but when checked with an
>> oscilloscope (TEK 465B) it shows about 50 Hz. Even though the fridge
>> seems to run fine it sounds different than when operating from the
>> mains. The meter on it shows the voltage as being 115 volts and the
>> motor is running at the nameplate RPM. So what could be the reason for
>> the 'scope showing the lower Hz and is there anything I can do about
>> it? This generator uses brushes on a slip ring to energize the field
>> winding and has some type of transistorised voltage regulator.
>> Thanks,
>> Eric R Snow
>Small generators generally need to be adjusted so that the voltage and
>frequency are about 5 to 10 percent high with no load. Both will drop under
>load. I would try setting the engine speed up a bit. I would also suspect
>the oscilloscope calibration. The frequency cannot be incorrect when the
>engine speed is correct if it is a direct connected generator.
>
>Don Young
>
To remove any doubt about the scope calibration, sync the scope
horizontal sweep to commercial power, and look at the generator
output. When the engine speed is correct, the waveform on the scope
should be stable, or drifting very slowly one way or the other.
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Author: Phil AllisonDate: 18:17 20-12-06
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"James Beck"
>>
>> > I have a small generator (700 watt, 850 surge) that I use to keep the
>> > fridge running when the power is out. It is a robust unit made by
>> > Robin and is at least 20 years old. It has an accurate analog
>> > voltmeter on it. I tested it by comparing to a digital meter and by
>> > directly connecting just the meter to the 115 volt, 60 Hz mains. The
>> > label says that the generator puts out 60 Hz but when checked with an
>> > oscilloscope (TEK 465B) it shows about 50 Hz.
>>
>>
>> ** Test it with an electric clock or clock radio.
>>
>> See how much time the clock loses over a few minutes.
>>
>
> What would that accomplish above and beyond looking at the signal with
> an O'scope?
** A scope trace may be out of calibration, maladjusted or misread.
> I would think the scope would be the preferred method and
> the clock using the 60Hz as a timbase would be the "I a'int got no
> scope" option.
** The clock method is vastly more precise and fool proof.
> If his O'scope showed about 50Hz I would think it is
> about 50Hz.
** Time to improve your thinking - fuckhead.
....... Phil
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Author: Tom BiasiDate: 19:52 20-12-06
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"Phil Allison" <philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:4utujvF19g0hhU1@mid.individual.net...
>
> "James Beck"
>
>>>
>>> > I have a small generator (700 watt, 850 surge) that I use to keep the
>>> > fridge running when the power is out. It is a robust unit made by
>>> > Robin and is at least 20 years old. It has an accurate analog
>>> > voltmeter on it. I tested it by comparing to a digital meter and by
>>> > directly connecting just the meter to the 115 volt, 60 Hz mains. The
>>> > label says that the generator puts out 60 Hz but when checked with an
>>> > oscilloscope (TEK 465B) it shows about 50 Hz.
>>>
>>>
>>> ** Test it with an electric clock or clock radio.
>>>
>>> See how much time the clock loses over a few minutes.
>>>
>>
>> What would that accomplish above and beyond looking at the signal with
>> an O'scope?
>
>
> ** A scope trace may be out of calibration, maladjusted or misread.
>
>
>> I would think the scope would be the preferred method and
>> the clock using the 60Hz as a timbase would be the "I a'int got no
>> scope" option.
>
>
> ** The clock method is vastly more precise and fool proof.
>
>
>> If his O'scope showed about 50Hz I would think it is
>> about 50Hz.
>
>
> ** Time to improve your thinking - fuckhead.
>
>
>
>
> ....... Phil
>
>
>
>
>
Phil,
Take you medicine.
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Author: Phil AllisonDate: 20:29 20-12-06
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"Tom Biasi " = Jerk Off Scumbag
Go choke on a dog turd - cuntbrain.
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Author: meDate: 22:32 20-12-06
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Peter Bennett <peterbb@somewhere.invalid> wrote in
news:odoio21m9ahktggsjkfepddqg2i6k4phps@news.supernews.com:
>On Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:36:59 -0600, "Don Young" <notme@nonesuch.com>
>wrote:
>
>>
>>"Eric R Snow" <etpm@whidbey.com> wrote in message
>>news:kidgo2thapdvh1p0f8vqr3b32pjvf1rolt@4ax.com...
>>> Greetungs All,
>>> I have a small generator (700 watt, 850 surge) that I use to keep
>>> the fridge running when the power is out. It is a robust unit made
>>> by Robin and is at least 20 years old. It has an accurate analog
>>> voltmeter on it. I tested it by comparing to a digital meter and by
>>> directly connecting just the meter to the 115 volt, 60 Hz mains. The
>>> label says that the generator puts out 60 Hz but when checked with
>>> an oscilloscope (TEK 465B) it shows about 50 Hz. Even though the
>>> fridge seems to run fine it sounds different than when operating
>>> from the mains. The meter on it shows the voltage as being 115 volts
>>> and the motor is running at the nameplate RPM. So what could be the
>>> reason for the 'scope showing the lower Hz and is there anything I
>>> can do about it? This generator uses brushes on a slip ring to
>>> energize the field winding and has some type of transistorised
>>> voltage regulator. Thanks,
>>> Eric R Snow
>>Small generators generally need to be adjusted so that the voltage and
>>frequency are about 5 to 10 percent high with no load. Both will drop
>>under load. I would try setting the engine speed up a bit. I would
>>also suspect the oscilloscope calibration. The frequency cannot be
>>incorrect when the engine speed is correct if it is a direct connected
>>generator.
>>
>>Don Young
>>
>
>To remove any doubt about the scope calibration, sync the scope
>horizontal sweep to commercial power, and look at the generator
>output. When the engine speed is correct, the waveform on the scope
>should be stable, or drifting very slowly one way or the other.
>
>
>
>
>
or look at the powerline frequency on the scope, if its ok then the other
measurement is likely ok....
----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----
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Author: DaveDate: 16:21 21-12-06
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"Phil Allison" <philallison@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:4uu6brF199n23U1@mid.individual.net...
>
> "Tom Biasi " = Jerk Off Scumbag
>
>
> Go choke on a dog turd - cuntbrain.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
I'll have to remember these lines for those times when someone disagrees
with something I say, maybe, at a party.
You must hang with a tough crowd, Phil, or get beat up a lot. Or, and here
is the real deal: with your undersize penis, skinny little chicken arms and
receding hairline, you are too chickenshit to have this type of conversation
with another real person, so you choose a medium to offend where there is
virtually no likelihood of consequences. it's unfortunate for the rest of
us that you're such an offensive and antisocial bastard, because what you
say seems to have a degree of technical merit.
So sad....
Sorry for the rant, group.
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Author: Phil AllisonDate: 19:15 21-12-06
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"Dave the Asinine " MeToo" Fuckwit. "
Go choke on a dog turd - cunthead.
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Author: James BeckDate: 10:47 22-12-06
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In article <4utujvF19g0hhU1@mid.individual.net>, philallison@tpg.com.au
says...
>
> "James Beck"
>
> >>
> >> > I have a small generator (700 watt, 850 surge) that I use to keep the
> >> > fridge running when the power is out. It is a robust unit made by
> >> > Robin and is at least 20 years old. It has an accurate analog
> >> > voltmeter on it. I tested it by comparing to a digital meter and by
> >> > directly connecting just the meter to the 115 volt, 60 Hz mains. The
> >> > label says that the generator puts out 60 Hz but when checked with an
> >> > oscilloscope (TEK 465B) it shows about 50 Hz.
> >>
> >>
> >> ** Test it with an electric clock or clock radio.
> >>
> >> See how much time the clock loses over a few minutes.
> >>
> >
> > What would that accomplish above and beyond looking at the signal with
> > an O'scope?
>
>
> ** A scope trace may be out of calibration, maladjusted or misread.
May be yes, but it is the tool of choice and BOY would it need to be out
of calibration for it to show 50Hz instead of 60Hz.
>
>
> > I would think the scope would be the preferred method and
> > the clock using the 60Hz as a timbase would be the "I a'int got no
> > scope" option.
>
>
> ** The clock method is vastly more precise and fool proof.
Huh?????
MAYBE, more fool proof, but I doubt more precise.
Plus, he can see any distortion in the sine wave.
Do that with your clock.
>
>
> > If his O'scope showed about 50Hz I would think it is
> > about 50Hz.
>
>
> ** Time to improve your thinking - fuckhead.
So, someone questions you and they are a fuckhead?
OK......
Jim
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Author: Phil AllisonDate: 21:31 22-12-06
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"James Beck"
Another congenital moron fucking up a potentially useful NG.
....... Phil
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Author: James BeckDate: 11:42 26-12-06
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Author: Phil AllisonDate: 17:32 26-12-06
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"James Beck"
Another congenital ASD fucked moron fucking up a potentially useful NG.
....... Phil
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Author: James BeckDate: 17:48 26-12-06
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In article <4vdm84F1c2de1U1@mid.individual.net>, philallison@tpg.com.au
says...
> Another congenital ASD fucked moron fucking up a potentially useful NG.
>
>
>
>
>
> ....... Phil
>
>
Please, stop top posting.
People will think you are some mean spirited asshole and not the self
flagellant that you really are. Now, be an adult and go away quietly.
Jim
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Author: Michael A. TerrellDate: 17:59 26-12-06
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James Beck wrote:
>
> In article <4vdm84F1c2de1U1@mid.individual.net>, philallison@tpg.com.au
> says...
> > Another congenital ASD fucked moron fucking up a potentially useful NG.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ....... Phil
> >
> >
> Please, stop top posting.
> People will think you are some mean spirited asshole and not the self
> flagellant that you really are. Now, be an adult and go away quietly.
>
> Jim
If he could do that, he wouldn't need the Talcum powder! ;-)
--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.
Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
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Author: Phil AllisonDate: 18:06 26-12-06
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"James Beck" <jim@reallykillersystems.com
What a fucking hoot !!!
The above, slimy, sub human pile of *white trash* from Georgia is a
coin-op machine tech !!
http://www.reallykillersystems.com/
Now the * penny drops * how come this congenital wanker is such a know
nothing scum bag.
ROTFLMAO !!!!
........ Phil
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Author: James BeckDate: 10:30 27-12-06
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In article <4vdo7mF1bmpgdU1@mid.individual.net>, philallison@tpg.com.au
says...
>
> "James Beck" <jim@reallykillersystems.com
> What a fucking hoot !!!
> The above, slimy, sub human pile of *white trash* from Georgia is a
> coin-op machine tech !!
>
> http://www.reallykillersystems.com/
>
> Now the * penny drops * how come this congenital wanker is such a know
> nothing scum bag.
>
> ROTFLMAO !!!!
>
Yep, been in the coin op business for almost 25 years.
I make no attempt to hide what industry I work in or what my email or
web address is. Why would I?
You really need to have your meds increased.
Such a spewing of hate and anger EVERY time someone questions something
you say. Now, since you are so much higher and mightier than I am you
will have no problem holding your tongue and going away like an adult,
but no, you will have to respond once again to fulfill your compulsion
to get in the last word.
Jim
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